What is the incentive to be loyal? - Page 2

Shorty · 04-11-2002, 05:36 PM

<blockquote>quote:<hr />Originally posted by Granny Hamner:
Again, Championship Manager has a good example of what's being discussed here. In fact, at the end of the season, the game tells which player was the Fans' Favorite. Dumping a popular player might also rub the other players the wrong way. ChampMan measures players "morale" with the club in a complex and interesting way. For example, if you pick up a foreign player, it helps to have another player on the team that speaks his language to maintain his morale. You can also fine players for misdeeds such as poor training habits and stupid plays. Adding features like these to OOTP4 would be terrific.<hr /></blockquote>Yeah, in C.M., sometimes when trading a player, you'll receive an email notifying you that the team has been shaken up or something. I dont remember, havent played in a while but its a great addition.

Draft Dodger · 04-11-2002, 07:45 PM

<blockquote>quote:<hr />Originally posted by thatsnotpr:
For example. Mike Piazza Dodger jerseys still sell out, and attendance and fan support was never the same since they traded him.

Him and Karros were best friends, and now Karros is quiet and bitter.

I would love to see this correspond with team chemistry (player persona ratings)<hr /></blockquote>that trade was such a dark, dark day...

thatsnotpr · 04-12-2002, 03:58 PM

<blockquote>quote:<hr />Originally posted by Draft Dodger:
[QUOTE]
that trade was such a dark, dark day...<hr /></blockquote>Will we ever get over it?

My guess? no.

HMKRich · 04-12-2002, 08:37 PM

<blockquote>quote:<hr />Originally posted by ScottVib:

<hr /></blockquote>However if Alomar had been loyal and not changed teams ever time a contract was up, he'd have 10-5 rights and could have refused the trade... so in the end he pays for his paycheck to paycheck loyalty.. and I have no problem with this.[/QUOTE]

Great point, Scott. Are you a lawyer?

ISiddiqui · 04-12-2002, 08:59 PM

<blockquote>quote:<hr />From what i remember Tino Martinez was not treated badly by the Yankees. In fact, Joe Torre called Tino on a small number of occassions to ask him if it was alright to go after Giambi. Ofcourse Tino would say yes b/c hes a class act guy but it wasnt as if the Yanks kicked him off the boat and didnt tell him what they were doing. Tino was fully aware of the situation and understood it was a business.<hr /></blockquote>I dunno... every Yank fan I've spoken too (and I live in Jersey, so we aren't talking one person <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="wink.gif" /> ) has said that were disapointed that Tino was shown the door by Steinbrenner, after what he did for that team. He might have known what they were going to do, but the argument is they never should have done it.

FastLane · 04-12-2002, 10:10 PM

...Which only fuels the whole Hired gun feel to the Yankees for the past two decades or so....

Steinbrenner has shown zero loyalty to NO-ONE....hell, he even gave Torre the old get-to-the postseason-or be-gone crap last year...That was tasteless. I hate the Yankees, but even I have enough sense to realize that they wouldnt be hoisting all the hardware the last couple of years without Torre. Team Loyalty starts at the top. If the ownership cant be loyal to the personnel, who do the personnel have to be loyal to?

CMH · 04-13-2002, 10:03 AM

ok you guys are right about Steinbrenner and his ways. He isnt loyal to anyone and thats very true. I blame it more on his competitive attitude and his feeling that "if i spent money on you, you should produce, otherwise i'll find someone else who could." I'm in no way defending him, but i'm sure thats the way he thinks. And while he has a point...it should also be stressed that if you sign someone, you should give them the opportunity to perform and prove to you they are worth your time.

However, sayin he has ZERO Loyalty is wrong. Think about how loyal and forgiving he has been to Daryl Strawberry and Doc Gooden. Those guys have turned their back on Steinbrenner plenty of times and George keeps forgiving them and even offers them office jobs. But i will add that he does need to try harder with the players on his team.

Another note...I do not know what Yankee fans are talking about...you must be talkin to fake yankee fans ISiddiqui b/c it was made clear from the beginning of the season that Tino Martinez would NOT be returning to Yankee Stadium this season or any season after in Pinstripes. The only difference is that many people believed it was because Nick Johnson would become the next firstbaseman. Instead the Yanks turned their attention to Jason Giambi. So i think what people should be sayin is that Nick Johnson was mistreated, but obviously, fake Yankee fans wouldnt even know who Nick Johnson is until late last year.

04-11-2002, 05:36 PM	#21
Shorty All Star Reserve Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: Cincinnati, Ohio Posts: 992	</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by Granny Hamner: <strong>Again, Championship Manager has a good example of what's being discussed here. In fact, at the end of the season, the game tells which player was the Fans' Favorite. Dumping a popular player might also rub the other players the wrong way. ChampMan measures players "morale" with the club in a complex and interesting way. For example, if you pick up a foreign player, it helps to have another player on the team that speaks his language to maintain his morale. You can also fine players for misdeeds such as poor training habits and stupid plays. Adding features like these to OOTP4 would be terrific.</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Yeah, in C.M., sometimes when trading a player, you'll receive an email notifying you that the team has been shaken up or something. I dont remember, havent played in a while but its a great addition. __________________ Here we go Redlegs here we go!

04-11-2002, 07:45 PM	#22
Draft Dodger Hall Of Famer Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: formerly of the OTBL Posts: 4,113	</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by thatsnotpr: <strong>For example. Mike Piazza Dodger jerseys still sell out, and attendance and fan support was never the same since they traded him. Him and Karros were best friends, and now Karros is quiet and bitter. I would love to see this correspond with team chemistry (player persona ratings)</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">that trade was such a dark, dark day... __________________ Draft Dodger (Anarchy: Anything goes. The Draft Dodger viewpoint.) Sophmoric[sic] Member of the OOTP Boards (It's not OOTP; it's your computer) 15 GB Webhosting for $6.95 a month IMO we are best off abandoning that sinking ship that is Off Topic to the rats infesting it and just starting a whole new Baseball Forum from scratch.

04-12-2002, 03:58 PM	#23
thatsnotpr Minors (Rookie Ball) Join Date: Feb 2002 Location: Los Angeles Posts: 47	</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by Draft Dodger: <strong>[QUOTE] that trade was such a dark, dark day...</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Will we ever get over it? My guess? no.

04-12-2002, 08:37 PM	#24
HMKRich Minors (Rookie Ball) Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Atlanta, Georgia USA Posts: 21	</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by ScottVib: <strong> </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">However if Alomar had been loyal and not changed teams ever time a contract was up, he'd have 10-5 rights and could have refused the trade... so in the end he pays for his paycheck to paycheck loyalty.. and I have no problem with this.</strong>[/QUOTE] Great point, Scott. Are you a lawyer?

04-12-2002, 08:59 PM	#25
ISiddiqui Minors (Rookie Ball) Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Decatur, Georgia, USA Posts: 30	</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">From what i remember Tino Martinez was not treated badly by the Yankees. In fact, Joe Torre called Tino on a small number of occassions to ask him if it was alright to go after Giambi. Ofcourse Tino would say yes b/c hes a class act guy but it wasnt as if the Yanks kicked him off the boat and didnt tell him what they were doing. Tino was fully aware of the situation and understood it was a business.</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">I dunno... every Yank fan I've spoken too (and I live in Jersey, so we aren't talking one person <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="wink.gif" /> ) has said that were disapointed that Tino was shown the door by Steinbrenner, after what he did for that team. He might have known what they were going to do, but the argument is they never should have done it.

04-12-2002, 10:10 PM	#26
FastLane Major Leagues Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Kansas City, MO Posts: 481	...Which only fuels the whole Hired gun feel to the Yankees for the past two decades or so.... Steinbrenner has shown zero loyalty to NO-ONE....hell, he even gave Torre the old get-to-the postseason-or be-gone crap last year...That was tasteless. I hate the Yankees, but even I have enough sense to realize that they wouldnt be hoisting all the hardware the last couple of years without Torre. Team Loyalty starts at the top. If the ownership cant be loyal to the personnel, who do the personnel have to be loyal to? __________________ You know it's summertime at Candlestick when the fog rolls in, the wind kicks up, and you see the center fielder slicing open a caribou to survive the ninth inning. ~Bob Sarlette Hating the New York Yankees is as American as apple pie, unwed mothers and cheating on your income tax. ~Mike Royko

04-13-2002, 10:03 AM	#27
CMH Hall Of Famer Join Date: Feb 2002 Posts: 5,057	ok you guys are right about Steinbrenner and his ways. He isnt loyal to anyone and thats very true. I blame it more on his competitive attitude and his feeling that "if i spent money on you, you should produce, otherwise i'll find someone else who could." I'm in no way defending him, but i'm sure thats the way he thinks. And while he has a point...it should also be stressed that if you sign someone, you should give them the opportunity to perform and prove to you they are worth your time. However, sayin he has ZERO Loyalty is wrong. Think about how loyal and forgiving he has been to Daryl Strawberry and Doc Gooden. Those guys have turned their back on Steinbrenner plenty of times and George keeps forgiving them and even offers them office jobs. But i will add that he does need to try harder with the players on his team. Another note...I do not know what Yankee fans are talking about...you must be talkin to fake yankee fans ISiddiqui b/c it was made clear from the beginning of the season that Tino Martinez would NOT be returning to Yankee Stadium this season or any season after in Pinstripes. The only difference is that many people believed it was because Nick Johnson would become the next firstbaseman. Instead the Yanks turned their attention to Jason Giambi. So i think what people should be sayin is that Nick Johnson was mistreated, but obviously, fake Yankee fans wouldnt even know who Nick Johnson is until late last year.