U of M -- ND - Page 2

mh2365 · 09-16-2007, 10:56 PM

Willingham had one good recruiting class at ND. Weis gets credit because Quinn was throwing a ton of int's before Weis got there and Samardzija was on the scout team. Willingham's last two recruiting classes were horrible including one that was outside the top 30 and included a total of 14 players.

Weis is not without fault this year. His insistence to stick with Latina as the O-Line coach after the horrible year the o-line had last year is a problem. Also his arrogance about thinking he can out think everyone instead of doing it.

But to ignore how horrible the junior, senior and 5th year senior players are on ND is just plain ignorance about the situation. Not many people including diehard fans expected to have a good year this year. Obviously we didn't think it would be this bad, but show me one other school in the country that regularly has 8 to 9 freshman and sophomores on the field at the same time.

2007 is going to be a bad season and all the haters will be able to take their shots, but this will be ND's 3rd straight top 10 recruiting class under Weis (with the same requirements Willingham had) and things will get better.

One last thing ... every single problem with ND football right now starts and ends with the Offensive line.

Go Tribe · 09-17-2007, 11:49 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mh2365

Willingham had one good recruiting class at ND. Weis gets credit because Quinn was throwing a ton of int's before Weis got there and Samardzija was on the scout team. Willingham's last two recruiting classes were horrible including one that was outside the top 30 and included a total of 14 players.

Weis is not without fault this year. His insistence to stick with Latina as the O-Line coach after the horrible year the o-line had last year is a problem. Also his arrogance about thinking he can out think everyone instead of doing it.

But to ignore how horrible the junior, senior and 5th year senior players are on ND is just plain ignorance about the situation. Not many people including diehard fans expected to have a good year this year. Obviously we didn't think it would be this bad, but show me one other school in the country that regularly has 8 to 9 freshman and sophomores on the field at the same time.

2007 is going to be a bad season and all the haters will be able to take their shots, but this will be ND's 3rd straight top 10 recruiting class under Weis (with the same requirements Willingham had) and things will get better.

One last thing ... every single problem with ND football right now starts and ends with the Offensive line.

not sure if it's 8 or 9 but ohio state is playing a ton of freshmen and sophs this year, not even including their starting qb who, although a junior, has no experience whatsoever thanks to backing troy smith the last 2-3 years.

in fact on defense, they start 6 sophs (including 3 of their 4 defensive backs), 4 juniors and one senior (who's first two years were spent at junior college).

their starting tailback, wr and center are all sophs as well

again not 8-9 but enough

Go Tribe · 09-17-2007, 11:59 AM

http://collegefootball.rivals.com/cd...Team=NOTREDAME

weird, i don't see 8-9 freshmen, sophs starting on either side of the ball for notre dame. must be one of those medieval maps

Prodigal Son · 09-17-2007, 01:09 PM

Iowa has 21 underclassmen listed on the two-deeps, including 11 freshmen. The starting offensive line has no seniors, one junior, and four underclassmen, including a true freshman. Three of the top four receivers are frosh.

Of course, Iowa isn't looking to be a particularly good team, but, well...they're no Notre Dame!

mh2365 · 09-17-2007, 02:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Go Tribe

http://collegefootball.rivals.com/cd...Team=NOTREDAME

weird, i don't see 8-9 freshmen, sophs starting on either side of the ball for notre dame. must be one of those medieval maps

Show me where I said starting? Plus there hasn't been one single game this year where the group listed as starters on that page have started. But nice try.

mh2365 · 09-17-2007, 02:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Prodigal Son

Iowa has 21 underclassmen listed on the two-deeps, including 11 freshmen. The starting offensive line has no seniors, one junior, and four underclassmen, including a true freshman. Three of the top four receivers are frosh.

Of course, Iowa isn't looking to be a particularly good team, but, well...they're no Notre Dame!

Iowa is very young and they have indeed played better than ND. Of course they have an O-Line coach that teaches them how to block, so that helps.

Skipaway · 09-17-2007, 03:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mh2365

Show me where I said starting? Plus there hasn't been one single game this year where the group listed as starters on that page have started. But nice try.

We all knew Weis had some crazy depth charts so far this season. The team is still in pre-season mode after all! Surely it helps a young team to develop by not really letting anybody have fixed roles.

Maybe Weis' plan is to simply not trying at all this season, and using it purely for preparing the next season?

a87star · 09-17-2007, 03:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Skipaway

Maybe Weis' plan is to simply not trying at all this season, and using it purely for preparing the next season?

If Weis wasn't trying this year, would he be coaching?

mh2365 · 09-17-2007, 03:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Skipaway

We all knew Weis had some crazy depth charts so far this season. The team is still in pre-season mode after all! Surely it helps a young team to develop by not really letting anybody have fixed roles.

Maybe Weis' plan is to simply not trying at all this season, and using it purely for preparing the next season?

Now this is a homer speaking but I honestly think Weis is overthinking everything. In 2 of the 3 games he tried to do things that he just doesn't do. Run the option? Run trick plays?

He needs to fire Latina and take over the O-Line on his own until he gets to the offseason. Every problem they have begins and ends with the O-Line right now.

I doubt he isn't trying but I think he knows this is a throw away season and I think he knew it going in.

Okay I have to get out of this thread because I'm too much of a homer. Take your shots at ND this year though!!!

Skipaway · 09-17-2007, 03:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mh2365

Now this is a homer speaking but I honestly think Weis is overthinking everything. In 2 of the 3 games he tried to do things that he just doesn't do. Run the option? Run trick plays?

I would believe this is a key element for the huge problems so far. It's probably made a lot more sense if Weis was leading a veteran Patriots team to try all the different things against all the different opponents using different mixes of players.

For a team that isn't sure that it could do one thing well yet, trying too many things might be what made them looked so bad. No wonder they want to go back to training camp.

jaxmagicman · 09-17-2007, 03:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mh2365

but show me one other school in the country that regularly has 8 to 9 freshman and sophomores on the field at the same time.

Florida- Tim Tebow, Percy Harvin, Wondy Pierre-Louis, Deonte Thompson, Jarred Fayson, Chas Henry, Chris Rainey, and almost the whole offensive line.

Go Tribe · 09-17-2007, 06:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jaxmagicman

Florida- Tim Tebow, Percy Harvin, Wondy Pierre-Louis, Deonte Thompson, Jarred Fayson, Chas Henry, Chris Rainey, and almost the whole offensive line.

hey he said "show me one other team" - we've aready shown him two - this is just piling on!

mh2365 · 09-17-2007, 08:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Go Tribe

hey he said "show me one other team" - we've aready shown him two - this is just piling on!

At least you got my words right this time

mh2365 · 09-17-2007, 08:16 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by: GeorgiaIrish
Ho

Well I share what I can, and there are many of my friends on these boards who know what is going on also. So I try to share what I can and leave it at that. Some folks would rather have what I can share then not sharing anything at all. But just one little tidbit, how many times did you see the O Linemen helping Quinn up after a sack, how many O Linemen are helping Clausen up after a sack. Hmm I cant remember any.

Here's a post from the B&G board that even ND haters can laugh at as the most ******ed thing ever said.

His inside information tells him that the O-Line doesn't like Clausen so they are intentionally letting him get killed.

Well what about Thomas, Aldridge and Allen? Guess they hate them too. What about Jones and Sharpley in the GT game, they got sacked 9 times ... man who does the o-line like?

Prodigal Son · 09-17-2007, 08:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mh2365

man who does the o-line like?

Brandon Graham.

marc · 09-17-2007, 09:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Go Tribe

not sure if it's 8 or 9 but ohio state is playing a ton of freshmen and sophs this year, not even including their starting qb who, although a junior, has no experience whatsoever thanks to backing troy smith the last 2-3 years.

in fact on defense, they start 6 sophs (including 3 of their 4 defensive backs), 4 juniors and one senior (who's first two years were spent at junior college).

their starting tailback, wr and center are all sophs as well

again not 8-9 but enough

Yep, there are sooo many freshmen and sophomores playing this year for OSU. 6 starters on defense and 3 on offense. Then you have the 2nd string which plays almost as much as the 1st string at a lot of positions and they are made up of almost entirely sophomores and freshmen.

I agree that Willingham's last 2 classes were pretty bad and that Weis should get some slack for that but there's no excuse for the performances in the last 3 games. I'd expect a starting lineup of 22 true freshmen to perform about 5 times better than this current ND group is performing and THAT has to go on Weis.

It's not like ND is playing tough and just doesn't have the horses to finish games off or are just outmatched and losing by 10-14 points.

mh2365 · 09-17-2007, 11:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by marc

Yep, there are sooo many freshmen and sophomores playing this year for OSU. 6 starters on defense and 3 on offense. Then you have the 2nd string which plays almost as much as the 1st string at a lot of positions and they are made up of almost entirely sophomores and freshmen.

I agree that Willingham's last 2 classes were pretty bad and that Weis should get some slack for that but there's no excuse for the performances in the last 3 games. I'd expect a starting lineup of 22 true freshmen to perform about 5 times better than this current ND group is performing and THAT has to go on Weis.

It's not like ND is playing tough and just doesn't have the horses to finish games off or are just outmatched and losing by 10-14 points.

Hard to argue against. From here on out this year I will only argue when someone says something as ******ed as the post I quoted above, or if someone says we should have kept Ty-tanic.

Prodigal Son · 09-17-2007, 11:33 PM

I see both sides of this argument, but the bottom line is that Notre Dame is playing horrible right now, far below their talent level. Their classes lately may not have been Notre Dame-esque (compared to history), but they've been pretty good compared to most DI teams' classes. Regardless, outside of Notre Dame having a roster full of middle-schoolers, they should be playing better than they are right now. They are looking terrible.

mh2365 · 09-17-2007, 11:36 PM

Absolutely .. but like I have been saying there problems begin and end on the Offensive line. Fix that and they play better.

Go Tribe · 09-28-2007, 03:11 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mh2365

Absolutely .. but like I have been saying there problems begin and end on the Offensive line. Fix that and they play better.

well losing OG Chris Stewart didn't help - this is four 4 Star recruits from the 2006 class that have already jumped ship - not looking good for Charlie

09-16-2007, 10:56 PM	#21
mh2365 Banned Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: louisville Posts: 14,941 Infractions: 0/2 (101)	Willingham had one good recruiting class at ND. Weis gets credit because Quinn was throwing a ton of int's before Weis got there and Samardzija was on the scout team. Willingham's last two recruiting classes were horrible including one that was outside the top 30 and included a total of 14 players. Weis is not without fault this year. His insistence to stick with Latina as the O-Line coach after the horrible year the o-line had last year is a problem. Also his arrogance about thinking he can out think everyone instead of doing it. But to ignore how horrible the junior, senior and 5th year senior players are on ND is just plain ignorance about the situation. Not many people including diehard fans expected to have a good year this year. Obviously we didn't think it would be this bad, but show me one other school in the country that regularly has 8 to 9 freshman and sophomores on the field at the same time. 2007 is going to be a bad season and all the haters will be able to take their shots, but this will be ND's 3rd straight top 10 recruiting class under Weis (with the same requirements Willingham had) and things will get better. One last thing ... every single problem with ND football right now starts and ends with the Offensive line. Last edited by mh2365; 09-16-2007 at 10:58 PM.

09-17-2007, 11:59 AM	#23
Go Tribe All Star Starter Join Date: Dec 2001 Posts: 1,534 Infractions: 1/0 (0)	http://collegefootball.rivals.com/cd...Team=NOTREDAME weird, i don't see 8-9 freshmen, sophs starting on either side of the ball for notre dame. must be one of those medieval maps

09-17-2007, 01:09 PM	#24
Prodigal Son All Star Starter Join Date: May 2006 Location: Iahiodo a.k.a. the flyover Posts: 1,635	Iowa has 21 underclassmen listed on the two-deeps, including 11 freshmen. The starting offensive line has no seniors, one junior, and four underclassmen, including a true freshman. Three of the top four receivers are frosh. Of course, Iowa isn't looking to be a particularly good team, but, well...they're no Notre Dame!

09-17-2007, 11:33 PM	#38
Prodigal Son All Star Starter Join Date: May 2006 Location: Iahiodo a.k.a. the flyover Posts: 1,635	I see both sides of this argument, but the bottom line is that Notre Dame is playing horrible right now, far below their talent level. Their classes lately may not have been Notre Dame-esque (compared to history), but they've been pretty good compared to most DI teams' classes. Regardless, outside of Notre Dame having a roster full of middle-schoolers, they should be playing better than they are right now. They are looking terrible.

09-17-2007, 11:36 PM	#39
mh2365 Banned Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: louisville Posts: 14,941 Infractions: 0/2 (101)	Absolutely .. but like I have been saying there problems begin and end on the Offensive line. Fix that and they play better.