4th round steal

[bababui]

You guys are missing a point or two.

1)Dumping Moss frees millions of cap space

2)Moss is disruptive if he doesnt get his way..as good as Brady is, it isnt like he has Culpeppers arm. How many deep balls will he get in the Pats offense?

3)The Lions totally misused/abused Mike Williams. They tried to force him to play TE and they set highly unrealistic weight goals for him. It should be telling that both Kiffin and Norm Chow were pursuing him. They will know how to use him.

[magnet]

2)Moss is disruptive if he doesnt get his way

Methinks you have no idea what you are talking about here. Example, please?

[bababui]

Originally Posted by magnet

Methinks you have no idea what you are talking about here. Example, please?

Have you been comatose through the last two seasons?

[bababui]

Dola

Do you have an understanding of why the Raiders were only able to get a 4th for him?

[magnet]

Originally Posted by bababui

Have you been comatose through the last two seasons?

Oh, you mean where he talks about how the Raiders suck?

How can you say that Moss "disrupted" the Raiders? So if he kept his yap shut, they would have won?

[magnet]

Originally Posted by bababui

Dola

Do you have an understanding of why the Raiders were only able to get a 4th for him?

Yeah. He = old.

[USN Squid]

Is it week one yet????

[magnet]

Originally Posted by USN Squid

Is it week one yet????

I knew you'd be excited.

[bababui]

Originally Posted by magnet

Yeah. He = old.

No. He=immature/selfish/a quitter/disruptive to a team.

Read any of the million articles about him. When a player with his physical tools is traded twice in the NFL that says something about that player. When a player is traded that seemingly would be a great asset for a QB like Russell that says something about a player.

[magnet]

Originally Posted by bababui

No. He=immature/selfish/a quitter/disruptive to a team.

Read any of the million articles about him. When a player with his physical tools is traded twice in the NFL that says something about that player. When a player is traded that seemingly would be a great asset for a QB like Russell that says something about a player.

I think it says something about the management of the team and the
"what have you done for me lately" mentality of the NFL.

Immature? Sure, in 1999.
Selfish? To a certain extent, yes. His happiness does rest on how well his TEAM is performing, however.
A quitter? Early in his career he could have fallen under this. I think he's changed a LOT from "I play when I want to play".
disruptive to team? You keep spouting this, and I have yet to see one shred of evidence that he actually hampered his team.

[bababui]

Originally Posted by magnet

I think it says something about the management of the team and the
"what have you done for me lately" mentality of the NFL.

Immature? Sure, in 1999.
Selfish? To a certain extent, yes. His happiness does rest on how well his TEAM is performing, however.
A quitter? Early in his career he could have fallen under this. I think he's changed a LOT from "I play when I want to play".
disruptive to team? You keep spouting this, and I have yet to see one shred of evidence that he actually hampered his team.

Well, his quitting on plays and not going 100% didnt sit well with the Raiders. One of several examples...


http://the.honoluluadvertiser.com/ar...913506478.html

"Moss quit on us last year," one Raiders employee said. "My feeling is he wants to go someplace where they can win. He knows he only has X number of years left and he's never, ever won at any level."

"I don't think that works," a personnel director for an AFC team said. "I'd develop other guys. You don't want him. It will be a big story. The story will be him, not your team."

Last season, a Raiders source said Moss didn't like quarterback Aaron Brooks from Day 1 and at one point asked to be traded. When the trade didn't happen, Moss basically went through the motions.
"When we didn't trade him he was like a little kid who threw a tantrum when his parents wouldn't give him something," the source said. "So his tantrum was dropping passes."

"Unfortunately for Randy, it's everybody else's fault except his," said Carl Peterson, president of the Kansas City Chiefs. "I thought Art (Shell) really tried to work hard this year to make him a leader, but that's not his personality. He's never done anything to hurt the Chiefs."

[jbergey22]

Originally Posted by bababui

You guys are missing a point or two.

1)Dumping Moss frees millions of cap space

2)Moss is disruptive if he doesnt get his way..as good as Brady is, it isnt like he has Culpeppers arm. How many deep balls will he get in the Pats offense?

3)The Lions totally misused/abused Mike Williams. They tried to force him to play TE and they set highly unrealistic weight goals for him. It should be telling that both Kiffin and Norm Chow were pursuing him. They will know how to use him.

1. Good point and Moss needed out of Oakland

2. Moss can play bottom line, he can do other things rather than simply run straight down the field the Brady/Culpepper comparison has no relevance on what Moss will be able to do

3.Mike Williams sucks SIMPLE.

[mrskippy]

Originally Posted by mauboy

Russell will impact this year?? As far as I've heard its the other way around.

Potentially, at least in comparison to Quinn. My guess is Kiffin will use McCown or someone else in the interim ... using Russell only when he is ready or when absolutely necessary. I think Russell could be ready much sooner than people expect. A #1 pick should pay off sooner than a later pick.

[mrskippy]

Originally Posted by magnet

""!

When was the last real trouble he caused? When he hit that traffic controller downtown 5 years ago? Of course, if you ask ESPN, they'll mention the mooning, and basically saying what everyone already knew about the Raiders last season.

Moss blew a lot of potential catches, let guys intercept the ball right in front of him, and so on. He whined a lot and pretty much was a cancer on the team. Being a cancer on the Raiders is saying something, given the Raiders history of wanting the biggest heads and egos in the NFL.

He didn't like being on a losing team and IMHO his play reflected that.

Nevermind the free cap space that the Raiders can use on more productive, more effective players.

Glad he is gone!!!

[magnet]

Originally Posted by bababui

Well, his quitting on plays and not going 100% didnt sit well with the Raiders. One of several examples...


http://the.honoluluadvertiser.com/ar...913506478.html

And you think that Belichick is going to take that sort of attitude for one second? Not like Randy will act up in NE; they actually win football games out there.

Of course, the "He just wants to win" defense of these actions is pretty thin, and I'll be the first to admit that.

[magnet]

Originally Posted by mrskippy

Moss blew a lot of potential catches, let guys intercept the ball right in front of him, and so on. He whined a lot and pretty much was a cancer on the team. Being a cancer on the Raiders is saying something, given the Raiders history of wanting the biggest heads and egos in the NFL.

He didn't like being on a losing team and IMHO his play reflected that.

Nevermind the free cap space that the Raiders can use on more productive, more effective players.

Glad he is gone!!!

No doubt it's good for the Raiders, but I think given Moss's personality when he is on a winning team, and how good of a player he is, NE still got one hell of a steal here. The Vikings got a 2nd rounder for C-Pep, and I'd say Moss was more pivotal to C-Pep than the other way around.

[mrskippy]

Originally Posted by bababui

Dola

Do you have an understanding of why the Raiders were only able to get a 4th for him?

Exactly. If he was Randy Moss from his peak in Minnesota, they are getting a #1 pick in 08, a few other picks, and maybe even another decent player in return.

Moss probably has peaked and I don't think he'll ever return to true form. He'll probably do better in NE than in OAK. Good for him.

And, I agree on the Mike Williams comment.

Back to the original topic -- Michael Bush could be the steal of the draft. If he can return to form and his pre-2006 projections (before he was hurt, he was expected to go Top 10 in the draft) he will be the steal.

If Bush works out and if Williams can post good numbers the Raiders will be great. Porter, Williams, and Curry as your main WR, plus Rhodes in the backfield (and eventually Bush getting in at some point), a stud QB -- the Raiders are in good shape. They've added a potentially decent TE.

I'm surprised they didn't try to snag some OL help (a huge weakness), but perhaps that is where the Raiders will put some of their saved cash from Moss.

[mrskippy]

Originally Posted by magnet

No doubt it's good for the Raiders, but I think given Moss's personality when he is on a winning team, and how good of a player he is, NE still got one hell of a steal here. The Vikings got a 2nd rounder for C-Pep, and I'd say Moss was more pivotal to C-Pep than the other way around.

If he works out in NE, good for them. He is a good player, no denying. But, he just wasn't going to work in Oakland.

The Raiders are rebuilding and I think they are focused on finally going young for a change.

[magnet]

Originally Posted by mrskippy

If he works out in NE, good for them. He is a good player, no denying. But, he just wasn't going to work in Oakland.

The Raiders are rebuilding and I think they are focused on finally going young for a change.

Exactly. If they were to get an older WR, they'd need someone with some leadership qualities to help get Williams and Porter to where they need to be.

[bababui]

Originally Posted by magnet

And you think that Belichick is going to take that sort of attitude for one second? Not like Randy will act up in NE; they actually win football games out there.

Of course, the "He just wants to win" defense of these actions is pretty thin, and I'll be the first to admit that.

I hope you are right and individually Moss succeeds. But maybe this move speaks to the desperation the Pats are facing. And why would they agree to pay Moss a lot more than Branch wanted?? A move that likely cost them a Super Bowl trip.