PbP oddity - Page 2

molarmite · 12-24-2006, 01:02 PM

Has anyone TT'ed this yet, if not I'll get it in there soon so we don't forget.

albatross11 · 12-24-2006, 04:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by molarmite

Has anyone TT'ed this yet, if not I'll get it in there soon so we don't forget.

I don't believe it has been TT'ed yet, molarmite. Thanks to all for looking into these. I understand that they're not all that important to a lot of people, but it can be distracting for some.

albatross11 · 01-03-2007, 06:51 PM

A new one:

Attachment 66500

albatross11 · 01-13-2007, 05:58 PM

...and here we go:

Attachment 67376

albatross11 · 01-14-2007, 05:51 PM

A new (and rather odd) one:

Attachment 67472

Although I suppose the batter could have hit a ball that stayed right near HP, but the PbP doesn't indicate that.

albatross11 · 01-18-2007, 02:04 AM

Another one:

Attachment 67854

The PbP also didn't mention which outfielder made the play.

Curtis · 01-18-2007, 10:06 AM

Not to distract you, but what do 'groundball 3S' 'groundball 13S' and 'groundball 4M' mean?

albatross11 · 01-18-2007, 12:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Curtis

Not to distract you, but what do 'groundball 3S' 'groundball 13S' and 'groundball 4M' mean?

There's a chart the game uses to indicate location of the "ball in play", or something along those lines. I don't fully understand it. I guess someone who does understand it could figure out which outfielder was involved in the above play.
You can see the chart here: www.retrosheet.org/location.htm
There are probably some threads in the forums disccussing this.

Curtis · 01-18-2007, 12:55 PM

How cool is that! So in the above examples there were groundballs that first hit the ground in front of first base ('3S'), between the pitcher and the first base line ('13S') and just to the right of second base ('4M').

I'm guessing the centerfielder got the assist on that play.

albatross11 · 01-18-2007, 01:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Curtis

How cool is that! So in the above examples there were groundballs that first hit the ground in front of first base ('3S'), between the pitcher and the first base line ('13S') and just to the right of second base ('4M').

I'm guessing the centerfielder got the assist on that play.

Yep, that's how it works. And, it is pretty interesting.
I would also guess the CF based on that chart. The game probably is giving credit to the correct fielders despite what the PbP says (or doesn't say), but we'll never know

.

albatross11 · 01-24-2007, 04:52 PM

Another example of a catcher "playing out of position" :

Attachment 68547

Here's the game log:

Attachment 68548

...and the box score:

Attachment 68549

albatross11 · 01-24-2007, 05:07 PM

Here's something I see a lot of, and I don't know how to really explain it. I'm wondering if it is causing the problem of a pinch-hitter staying in the game as a pinch-hitter, while the player he supposedly hit for remains in the game on defense.

Attachment 68550

Terre Haute is an AI controlled team. Richmond is human controlled. Note that for Terre Haute Shimizu pinch-hit for Drennan (the SS). Hong was then inserted at SS. The box score says "Hong substituted for Shimizu". Ok so far. But, look at Richmond. The exact same thing: Ramos pinch-hit for McNider (the SS). Daniels was inserted at SS, but there's no mention of him in the box score.
It always works like that. The AI team's substitution is noted, but the human-controlled team's is not. Don't know what it means (if anything), but I see it quite a bit.

endgame · 01-24-2007, 05:37 PM

I'm concerned that this thread remains in the Logged Issues while continuing to be subject to additions. As I review the thread, I'm not confident that I've actually seen a TT# assigned. Furthermore, what would the TT entail, the entirety of the thread no matter its length?

These are, in and of themselves, small issues but loom large in waning one's overall confidence. I don't want to see them overlooked: any of them. Could we get someone to direct us on either a proper course or assure us this is the one we should be following?

And albatroos, thanks for your continued contributions in this area.

albatross11 · 01-24-2007, 06:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by endgame

I'm concerned that this thread remains in the Logged Issues while continuing to be subject to additions. As I review the thread, I'm not confident that I've actually seen a TT# assigned. Furthermore, what would the TT entail, the entirety of the thread no matter its length?

These are, in and of themselves, small issues but loom large in waning one's overall confidence. I don't want to see them overlooked: any of them. Could we get someone to direct us on either a proper course or assure us this is the one we should be following?

And albatroos, thanks for your continued contributions in this area.

I'm pretty sure that these issues have no TT#, endgame, but I think it's due to what you said...what would theTT# entail? I just kept adding them here on the advice of some of the moderators. As you say, they're small, petty-looking errors, but I would think the folks who want accurate, realistic stats would be wondering about some of these. Is this player really making all those errors listed on his card? Is that player really making that number of assists? Are the At Bat totals correct? The Innings Played? And so on.

endgame · 01-24-2007, 07:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by albatross11

I'm pretty sure that these issues have no TT#, endgame, but I think it's due to what you said...what would theTT# entail?

Exactly. Why then is the thread in Logged Issues? That's an "acted-upon" or "duly-noted" status by my take. All I'm asking is, that being the case, is it being continually updated, noted, and acted upon? If not, it should be returned to the main support thread and stay there until all issues within it are addressed with specific TT's or assigned to Text Team editors. Can posts could be moved just as easily as threads? Maybe not. But filed away is not the answer if they're really not.

albatross11 · 01-24-2007, 10:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by endgame

Exactly. Why then is the thread in Logged Issues? That's an "acted-upon" or "duly-noted" status by my take. All I'm asking is, that being the case, is it being continually updated, noted, and acted upon? If not, it should be returned to the main support thread and stay there until all issues within it are addressed with specific TT's or assigned to Text Team editors. Can posts could be moved just as easily as threads? Maybe not. But filed away is not the answer if they're really not.

I think being assigned to the Text Team editors might be best.

albatross11 · 01-26-2007, 07:08 PM

.....

Attachment 68812

Tin of Maize · 02-26-2007, 03:25 PM

I wanted to add my two cents on this issue. I have also seen these mistakes in the PbP cropping up recently. I don't have any in particular to share but they are along the same lines - illogical or impossible calls, sometimes the play is called one way and then called again a different way.

I have been running a fictional league through about fifteen seasons and they are just showing up. Normally, I let the computer sim the regular season but then step in and manage if my team makes it to the playoffs. So all in all, I haven't managed a large number of games - probably no more than 75 or so. I don't know if that is relevant, but I thought I'd add it.

Also, I don't know if this is the same problem or another one, but I have also just noticed twice in the same playoff series instances where my runner is picked off first base despite me choosing the swing away button. Is that normal? I figured there would only be risk if you actually were stealing or hit and running.

12-24-2006, 01:02 PM	#21
molarmite Hall Of Famer Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: Minnesota Posts: 4,927	Has anyone TT'ed this yet, if not I'll get it in there soon so we don't forget. __________________ From the wise mind of Davey Eckstein "Now all you need is a signature. A quote or initial, perhaps." [

01-03-2007, 06:51 PM	#23
albatross11 All Star Reserve Join Date: Mar 2003 Posts: 907	A new one: Attachment 66500 __________________ Peace, albatross Last edited by albatross11; 06-05-2009 at 03:12 AM.

01-13-2007, 05:58 PM	#24
albatross11 All Star Reserve Join Date: Mar 2003 Posts: 907	...and here we go: Attachment 67376 __________________ Peace, albatross Last edited by albatross11; 06-05-2009 at 03:12 AM.

01-14-2007, 05:51 PM	#25
albatross11 All Star Reserve Join Date: Mar 2003 Posts: 907	A new (and rather odd) one: Attachment 67472 Although I suppose the batter could have hit a ball that stayed right near HP, but the PbP doesn't indicate that. __________________ Peace, albatross Last edited by albatross11; 06-05-2009 at 03:12 AM.

01-18-2007, 02:04 AM	#26
albatross11 All Star Reserve Join Date: Mar 2003 Posts: 907	Another one: Attachment 67854 The PbP also didn't mention which outfielder made the play. __________________ Peace, albatross Last edited by albatross11; 06-05-2009 at 03:12 AM.

01-18-2007, 10:06 AM	#27
Curtis Hall Of Famer Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: Watertown, New York Posts: 4,567	Not to distract you, but what do 'groundball 3S' 'groundball 13S' and 'groundball 4M' mean?

01-18-2007, 12:55 PM	#29
Curtis Hall Of Famer Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: Watertown, New York Posts: 4,567	How cool is that! So in the above examples there were groundballs that first hit the ground in front of first base ('3S'), between the pitcher and the first base line ('13S') and just to the right of second base ('4M'). I'm guessing the centerfielder got the assist on that play.

01-24-2007, 04:52 PM	#31
albatross11 All Star Reserve Join Date: Mar 2003 Posts: 907	Another example of a catcher "playing out of position" : Attachment 68547 Here's the game log: Attachment 68548 ...and the box score: Attachment 68549 __________________ Peace, albatross Last edited by albatross11; 06-05-2009 at 03:12 AM.

01-24-2007, 05:07 PM	#32
albatross11 All Star Reserve Join Date: Mar 2003 Posts: 907	Here's something I see a lot of, and I don't know how to really explain it. I'm wondering if it is causing the problem of a pinch-hitter staying in the game as a pinch-hitter, while the player he supposedly hit for remains in the game on defense. Attachment 68550 Terre Haute is an AI controlled team. Richmond is human controlled. Note that for Terre Haute Shimizu pinch-hit for Drennan (the SS). Hong was then inserted at SS. The box score says "Hong substituted for Shimizu". Ok so far. But, look at Richmond. The exact same thing: Ramos pinch-hit for McNider (the SS). Daniels was inserted at SS, but there's no mention of him in the box score. It always works like that. The AI team's substitution is noted, but the human-controlled team's is not. Don't know what it means (if anything), but I see it quite a bit. __________________ Peace, albatross Last edited by albatross11; 06-05-2009 at 03:12 AM.

01-24-2007, 05:37 PM	#33
endgame Hall Of Famer Join Date: Aug 2002 Posts: 16,842	I'm concerned that this thread remains in the Logged Issues while continuing to be subject to additions. As I review the thread, I'm not confident that I've actually seen a TT# assigned. Furthermore, what would the TT entail, the entirety of the thread no matter its length? These are, in and of themselves, small issues but loom large in waning one's overall confidence. I don't want to see them overlooked: any of them. Could we get someone to direct us on either a proper course or assure us this is the one we should be following? And albatroos, thanks for your continued contributions in this area. __________________ "Try again. Fail again. Fail better." -- Samuel Beckett _____________________________________________

01-26-2007, 07:08 PM	#37
albatross11 All Star Reserve Join Date: Mar 2003 Posts: 907	..... Attachment 68812 __________________ Peace, albatross Last edited by albatross11; 06-05-2009 at 03:12 AM.

02-26-2007, 03:25 PM	#38
Tin of Maize Minors (Single A) Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: Arlington, VA Posts: 81	Additional data on PbP problem I wanted to add my two cents on this issue. I have also seen these mistakes in the PbP cropping up recently. I don't have any in particular to share but they are along the same lines - illogical or impossible calls, sometimes the play is called one way and then called again a different way. I have been running a fictional league through about fifteen seasons and they are just showing up. Normally, I let the computer sim the regular season but then step in and manage if my team makes it to the playoffs. So all in all, I haven't managed a large number of games - probably no more than 75 or so. I don't know if that is relevant, but I thought I'd add it. Also, I don't know if this is the same problem or another one, but I have also just noticed twice in the same playoff series instances where my runner is picked off first base despite me choosing the swing away button. Is that normal? I figured there would only be risk if you actually were stealing or hit and running.