Unless this is changed, I am not likely to be buying OOTP 2006 - Page 2

LeiterFanatic · 05-24-2006, 10:52 PM

I think that you should look to WWSM or FM for guidance on this... what ratings and mechanics are hidden in those and does it kill the historical roster genre?

RBLwebguy · 05-24-2006, 10:52 PM

Have you ever seen an historical player in OOTP have similar numbers he had in real life? I can't say that I have, even with editing. Then again, I wasn't concerned with players behaving exactly the same.

CHCfan · 05-24-2006, 10:52 PM

Explain to me the difference between Jose Lima and Greg Maddux. Sure, it's easy - hundreds of wins. But explain the difference to me in terms of leadership and character. Once again, easy - loads of class and general likability. Now make a connection between the two . . .

Doibhilin · 05-24-2006, 10:52 PM

Quote:

You've missed the point completely. This is not about player *development*. This is about being unable to replicate developed historical players as they were.

But how can you determine the leadership, loyalty, clutch hitting, or consistency factors of a historical player? Some, like consistency, maybe you can generally model. But leadership? Are you going to dig up high school yearbooks and see which players were voted student council president?

These qualities are intangible and impossible to quantify. I kind of like that they are hidden; it seems more realistic than having a clear "loyalty" scale.

That said, I see your point. I guess it would be nice to be able to edit the hidden ratings through the player editor, and keep them hidden during gameplay. But I don't think many people will get that worked up about this. It's not the end of the world, nor of OOTP.

attackemu · 05-24-2006, 10:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CHCfan

Explain to me the difference between Jose Lima and Greg Maddux. Sure, it's easy - hundreds of wins. But explain the difference to me in terms of leadership and character. Once again, easy - loads of class and general likability. Now make a connection between the two . . .

Which is why David Eckstein is so much better than Barry Bonds, too!!!!!!!1

Mike Donlin · 05-24-2006, 10:55 PM

What does everyone have against Jose Lima?

KWhit · 05-24-2006, 10:56 PM

From an immersion and gameplay standpoint it actually makes 100% sense to keep these hidden. It's only after their on-field performance is viewed that we can make a determination on if they are clutch performers, injury-prone, loyal, etc...

silvam14 · 05-24-2006, 10:56 PM

This is not a deal breaker for me by any means because Im mostly a fictional league type, but, I see Mal's point. The only reason I would say this has gone on like this is because not many people I'm assuming actually create historical roster sets like you would Mal. I can imagine the depth and length of time that could go into editing each player rating. I'm just not sure this was taken into account. I could be wrong though.

Anyhoo, I hope this gets worked out for all the historical simmers.

Draft Dodger · 05-24-2006, 10:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by KWhit

It seems to me that these are all completely subjective ratings. It's not like it's obvious what a historical player's consistency or clutch performance is.

woah, let's not get carried away here. you can't just go and light the grandstand on fire.

look, I wouldn't mind seeing those ratings be editable (I've unsuccesfully lobbied in the past to make it easier for roster makers to edit those ratings). but it is NOT the huge impact Mr Drama is making it out to be. Perhaps someone would be willing to start an intelligent thread a little less, um, emphatically next time?

CubbyFan23 · 05-24-2006, 10:58 PM

I completely agree with MD on this issue. The option to toggle the ratings should be there, and possibly with a password lock on it for online leagues, but I remember FPS Baseball '98 had a hidden rating called "movement" that screwed with many a set.

I'm sure there will be an editor come out that will make these things editable, but it kind of annoys me that it has to be done that way.

On a side note... there's no expansion? Can someone link me to something discussing that? That is EASILY the most concerning news on this game I have heard.

canadiancreed · 05-24-2006, 10:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mike Donlin

What does everyone have against Jose Lima?

no-one lieks short names.

Faroo6 · 05-24-2006, 11:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mike Donlin

What does everyone have against Jose Lima?

They aren't married to his wife.

Draft Dodger · 05-24-2006, 11:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CubbyFan23

On a side note... there's no expansion? Can someone link me to something discussing that? That is EASILY the most concerning news on this game I have heard.

see, now THAT is a topic worthy of a false ultimatum.

RBLwebguy · 05-24-2006, 11:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CubbyFan23

I completely agree with MD on this issue. The option to toggle the ratings should be there, and possibly with a password lock on it for online leagues, but I remember FPS Baseball '98 had a hidden rating called "movement" that screwed with many a set.

I'm sure there will be an editor come out that will make these things editable, but it kind of annoys me that it has to be done that way.

On a side note... there's no expansion? Can someone link me to something discussing that? That is EASILY the most concerning news on this game I have heard.

There is no expansion in 6.5 either

Draft Dodger · 05-24-2006, 11:01 PM

well, my work here is done. off to go edit all my clutch ratings...
play nice, and BE COOL PEOPLE.

silvam14 · 05-24-2006, 11:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RBLwebguy

There is no expansion in 6.5 either

Good point! Come to think of it, there was no in-game expansion in ANY version of OOTP! But somehow we managed

RBLwebguy · 05-24-2006, 11:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by silvam14

Good point! Come to think of it, there was no in-game expansion in ANY version of OOTP! But somehow we managed

Exactly!

fantom1979 · 05-24-2006, 11:03 PM

http://www.ootpdevelopments.com/boar...d.php?t=118784
http://www.ootpdevelopments.com/boar...d.php?t=118672

I am just curious as to why this needed a new thread. There is already active threads for every issue you listed.

7 days, be cool man, be cool.

CubbyFan23 · 05-24-2006, 11:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RBLwebguy

There is no expansion in 6.5 either

Oh I was under the impression they meant you cannot add teams. So I can add teams, but there is just no automated process for an expansion draft, etc. I'm guessing then?

andymac · 05-24-2006, 11:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CubbyFan23

So I can add teams, but there is just no automated process for an expansion draft, etc. I'm guessing then?

Correct.

05-24-2006, 11:01 PM	#35
Draft Dodger Hall Of Famer Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: formerly of the OTBL Posts: 4,113	well, my work here is done. off to go edit all my clutch ratings... play nice, and BE COOL PEOPLE. __________________ Draft Dodger (Anarchy: Anything goes. The Draft Dodger viewpoint.) Sophmoric[sic] Member of the OOTP Boards (It's not OOTP; it's your computer) 15 GB Webhosting for $6.95 a month IMO we are best off abandoning that sinking ship that is Off Topic to the rats infesting it and just starting a whole new Baseball Forum from scratch.

05-24-2006, 11:03 PM	#38
fantom1979 Hall Of Famer Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: Detroit, MI Posts: 3,498	http://www.ootpdevelopments.com/boar...d.php?t=118784 http://www.ootpdevelopments.com/boar...d.php?t=118672 I am just curious as to why this needed a new thread. There is already active threads for every issue you listed. 7 days, be cool man, be cool. __________________

05-24-2006, 10:52 PM	#21
LeiterFanatic All Star Starter Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: Miami, FL Posts: 1,358	I think that you should look to WWSM or FM for guidance on this... what ratings and mechanics are hidden in those and does it kill the historical roster genre?

05-24-2006, 10:52 PM	#22
RBLwebguy Hall Of Famer Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Canuckistan Posts: 5,162	Have you ever seen an historical player in OOTP have similar numbers he had in real life? I can't say that I have, even with editing. Then again, I wasn't concerned with players behaving exactly the same.

05-24-2006, 10:52 PM	#23
CHCfan All Star Starter Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Grand Island, NE Posts: 1,117	Explain to me the difference between Jose Lima and Greg Maddux. Sure, it's easy - hundreds of wins. But explain the difference to me in terms of leadership and character. Once again, easy - loads of class and general likability. Now make a connection between the two . . .

05-24-2006, 10:55 PM	#26
Mike Donlin All Star Reserve Join Date: Sep 2004 Location: Life, friends, is boring. Posts: 840	What does everyone have against Jose Lima?

05-24-2006, 10:56 PM	#27
KWhit Major Leagues Join Date: Feb 2002 Posts: 413	From an immersion and gameplay standpoint it actually makes 100% sense to keep these hidden. It's only after their on-field performance is viewed that we can make a determination on if they are clutch performers, injury-prone, loyal, etc...

05-24-2006, 10:56 PM	#28
silvam14 Hall Of Famer Join Date: Apr 2004 Location: Dedham, MA Posts: 10,215	This is not a deal breaker for me by any means because Im mostly a fictional league type, but, I see Mal's point. The only reason I would say this has gone on like this is because not many people I'm assuming actually create historical roster sets like you would Mal. I can imagine the depth and length of time that could go into editing each player rating. I'm just not sure this was taken into account. I could be wrong though. Anyhoo, I hope this gets worked out for all the historical simmers.

05-24-2006, 10:58 PM	#30
CubbyFan23 Hall Of Famer Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: St. Louis, Missouri Posts: 2,257	I completely agree with MD on this issue. The option to toggle the ratings should be there, and possibly with a password lock on it for online leagues, but I remember FPS Baseball '98 had a hidden rating called "movement" that screwed with many a set. I'm sure there will be an editor come out that will make these things editable, but it kind of annoys me that it has to be done that way. On a side note... there's no expansion? Can someone link me to something discussing that? That is EASILY the most concerning news on this game I have heard.