The Hall of Fame Ballot

[Hammer755]

Originally Posted by Gastric ReFlux

This might be an excellent opportunity for Blyleven to get in.

It's going to be tough for any of those guys to make it. The sentiment about Blyleven may be right, but he only got 40% on the ballot last year, so that's an awful lot of people who would have to agree. Sutter came the closest last year with 67%, so he has a shot, but nobody else except Rice came close to breaking 60% (Goose got 55% & Dawson 52%).

[Mark Guest]

I like Will Clark, but I'm not too sure how generous the voters are willing to be this year.

[QuestGAV]

Originally Posted by Sublimity

Rice is passe. Change his name to Jim Couscous and he's money.

I believe Jim Orzo would be his best bet.

[Rasmuth]

as far as I'm concerned the only 2 truly worthy on that list are Blyleven and Rice....though I'd be willing to accept Garvey and Tommy John...

[TC Dale]

I dont see anyone making the Hall from that list even though I have a few favorites that I feel are deserving.

Hard to say anyone stands out in that group, but maybe one guy will make it.

A lot of good players, but not neccessarily HOF material. Their minuses really outweigh the positives for these guys.

[Spielman]

Originally Posted by ctorg

This year's ballot:

Rick Aguilera, Albert Belle, Bert Blyleven, Will Clark, Dave Concepcion, Andre Dawson, Gary DiSarcina, Alex Fernandez, Gary Gaetti, Steve Garvey, Dwight Gooden, Rich Gossage, Ozzie Guillen, Orel Hershiser, Gregg Jefferies, Tommy John, Doug Jones, Don Mattingly, Willie McGee, Hal Morris, Jack Morris, Dale Murphy, Dave Parker, Jim Rice, Lee Smith, Bruce Sutter, Alan Trammell, Walt Weiss, John Wetteland.

It's not a particularly strong one, so it may be time for some holdovers like Blyleven to get in. What do you think? Who gets in?

My votes?

Alan Trammell, Bert Blyleven, Rich Gossage.

Who do I think gets in?

Jim Rice, and either Bruce Sutter or Andre Dawson, one of the two.

[Dagrims]

I'd likely vote for Blyleven and Gossage only.

[darkhorse]

Let's see how WARP1 rates them based on career value.

People who don't put Blyleven on their ballot should lose the privilege.

Rick Aguilera      63.1
Albert Belle       72.0
Bert Blyleven     140.4
Will Clark         96.5
Dave Concepcion   104.4 
Andre Dawson      102.0 
Gary DiSarcina     10.0
Alex Fernandez     51.8 
Gary Gaetti        73.1 
Steve Garvey       89.3
Dwight Gooden      75.1
Rich Gossage       83.8 
Ozzie Guillen      41.6
Orel Hershiser     83.5 
Gregg Jefferies    38.8 
Tommy John        115.3
Doug Jones         62.7
Don Mattingly      81.9
Willie McGee       64.9
Hal Morris         35.3 
Jack Morris        89.3
Dale Murphy        93.3
Dave Parker        81.8 
Jim Rice           82.6 
Lee Smith          75.7 
Bruce Sutter       54.5
Alan Trammell     101.2 
Walt Weiss         34.7
John Wetteland     52.8

[dsvitak]

Originally Posted by darkhorse

Let's see how WARP1 rates them based on career value.

People who don't put Blyleven on their ballot should lose the privilege.

Rick Aguilera      63.1
Albert Belle       72.0
Bert Blyleven     140.4
Will Clark         96.5
Dave Concepcion   104.4 
Andre Dawson      102.0 
Gary DiSarcina     10.0
Alex Fernandez     51.8 
Gary Gaetti        73.1 
Steve Garvey       89.3
Dwight Gooden      75.1
Rich Gossage       83.8 
Ozzie Guillen      41.6
Orel Hershiser     83.5 
Gregg Jefferies    38.8 
Tommy John        115.3
Doug Jones         62.7
Don Mattingly      81.9
Willie McGee       64.9
Hal Morris         35.3 
Jack Morris        89.3
Dale Murphy        93.3
Dave Parker        81.8 
Jim Rice           82.6 
Lee Smith          75.7 
Bruce Sutter       54.5
Alan Trammell     101.2 
Walt Weiss         34.7
John Wetteland     52.8

I totally agree with your comment about Blyleven. WAY overdue.

[darkhorse]

Originally Posted by Spielman

Jim Rice, and either Bruce Sutter or Andre Dawson, one of the two.

Sutter would rival the worst selections in the history of the Hall.

[Davey Eckstein]

Gary DiSarcina career WARP1: 10.0
Barry Bonds' WARP1 in 2004: 15.0

[fantom1979]

It would have been nice to see the numbers Mattingly would have put up if he wasnt hampered by back problems. From '84 to '87 he was probably the most complete player in baseball. He was a 6 time all star, won an MVP, 9 gold gloves and had 2100 hits despite retiring at 34.

[darkhorse]

Originally Posted by fantom1979

It would have been nice to see the numbers Mattingly would have put up if he wasnt hampered by back problems. From '84 to '87 he was probably the most complete player in baseball. He was a 6 time all star, won an MVP, 9 gold gloves and had 2100 hits despite retiring at 34.

He was a great player. Dale Murphy's reign coincided, and was actually longer. From 82-87, Muscles whupped ass and seemed a mortal lock for Cooperstown.

[Dagrims]

Originally Posted by darkhorse

People who don't put Blyleven on their ballot should lose the privilege.

The privilege of putting him on their ballot? Doesn't sound very effective.

[darkhorse]

Originally Posted by Dagrims

The privilege of putting him on their ballot? Doesn't sound very effective.

I could have used "voters" instead of "people". Would this have inspired a better joke/pun? If so, my regrets.

[jf7623]

Originally Posted by ctorg

This year's ballot:

Rick Aguilera, Albert Belle, Bert Blyleven, Will Clark, Dave Concepcion, Andre Dawson, Gary DiSarcina, Alex Fernandez, Gary Gaetti, Steve Garvey, Dwight Gooden, Rich Gossage, Ozzie Guillen, Orel Hershiser, Gregg Jefferies, Tommy John, Doug Jones, Don Mattingly, Willie McGee, Hal Morris, Jack Morris, Dale Murphy, Dave Parker, Jim Rice, Lee Smith, Bruce Sutter, Alan Trammell, Walt Weiss, John Wetteland.

It's not a particularly strong one, so it may be time for some holdovers like Blyleven to get in. What do you think? Who gets in?

I would vote in:

Andre Dawson
Orel Hershiser
Don Mattingly
Dale Murphy
Lee Smith

And a write in vote for Pete Rose. He may have screwed up, but denying him a spot he deserves is just wrong. He gave alot to the game. Vote him in

[darkhorse]

Originally Posted by jf7623

denying Rose a spot he deserves is just wrong. He gave alot to the game. Vote him in

I'd wager that Palmeiro gave far more to the game of baseball and took far less, and I wonder if he'll get a well-deserved spot.

[UngratefulDead]

I'd vote Blyleven and Trammell only, and maybe not even Trammell.

[Davey Eckstein]

Originally Posted by jf7623

I would vote in:

Andre Dawson
Orel Hershiser
Don Mattingly
Dale Murphy
Lee Smith

And a write in vote for Pete Rose. He may have screwed up, but denying him a spot he deserves is just wrong. He gave alot to the game. Vote him in

No love for Uncle Bert?

[fantom1979]

Originally Posted by darkhorse

He was a great player. Dale Murphy's reign coincided, and was actually longer. From 82-87, Muscles whupped ass and seemed a mortal lock for Cooperstown.

It all comes back to, should a player get bonus points for having his career cut short by injury, or should the ability to stay healthy play a factor. If you are in the bonus points camp, then Mattingly gets in, if you are in the ability to stay healthy camp, then he does not.

One problem with Murphy is his .265 career average. He had a .279 career average after 1987, but then batted below .252 for 6 straight seasons. If you compare Mattingly with Murphy, Murphy had a better peak, but Mattingly's career peaked in his early 20's while Murphy peaked from 26 to 31 like you are supposed to do. If Mattingly had managed to avoid injury, who knows what kind of numbers he would have put up in his late 20's.

Did Murphy get hurt during the 87-88 offseason? His numbers after that great 87 season dramatically fell off.