Official Rolen/Cubby Player Rating Question Thread - Page 16

CubbyFan23 · 08-04-2006, 12:47 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by metball4

Cubby/Rolen..or whoever is qualified to answer.

First off THANK YOU for your hard work!

Now, would I be right to assume that these rosters out now are beta version and that there ARE problems that will be fixed. I.E. the rating system right now seems off unless im just used to the 1-10 ratings, and I can't seem to see anyone on my roster...

Thanks

Actually I have no clue what you're talking about... the rating system is the system that's going to be used, and I'm not sure why you can't see anyone on your roster?

pompeytir · 08-04-2006, 02:07 AM

Cubby,

You mentioned releasing your AAA roster Thursday evening. Is that on hold now? (Friday morning now).

Also, do you need help, or want to delegat some of the editing? If you have the list/changes of how you want things made; I have some free time now and for the next 10 days to help out. It beats waiting on them, sides I'm a night owl.

Let me know,

pompeytir@yahoo.com

Willmore · 08-04-2006, 03:12 AM

Still thursday over here.

CubbyFan23 · 08-04-2006, 04:39 AM

It's pretty close to finished, just four teams left I think, our wireless was down all day so all I could do was clean things up here and there.

CubbyFan23 · 08-04-2006, 04:49 AM

On a side note, I'm getting re-excited (is that a word?) looking over the AAA teams about the direction of this project. I think you all will be pretty satisfied with it, and there's still three or four levels to go.

The depth at each level of the minors I'm hoping is something that will really make people happy, I tried to get positions for every guy that they play (although missed some here and there), pitches, pitch speeds, correct bunting, speed, stealing bases, etc. ratings all down.

The good news is that the MLB/AAA levels were the hardest. I had the most information on these levels and was the most meticulous (sp) with them. While I plan on getting fairly deep at AA, in A/Low A/SS/etc. for a lot of the scrub guys there isn't much of a difference between them so I'll be mainly aiming at correct positions/speeds for guys that aren't in the top thirty-fourty prospects for a squad at lower levels.

I'm going to SHOOT for tomorrow night because I still have to add managers and coaches at AAA after I finish up these last few teams. However, as usual I'm not making any promises, just where it should end up if I don't hit any setbacks which I'm not forseeing right now.

CubbyFan23 · 08-04-2006, 04:53 AM

ALSO (last thing I swear!) people are always looking for things to do, one thing I COULD use is to get some discussion on coaching sliders for coaches. I haven't touched these and obviously they're going to change the way some stats are outputted (to make them more realistic). For instance, the A's don't steal much, LaRussa loves the squeeze, etc.

I'm not sure how to do this, and might start a thread tomorrow to compile thoughts on it. This includes GMs and their preference on OBP/avg, vets/young guys, etc.

(avoid the obligatory Jim Bowden loves washed up outfield prospects because it's not an option in OOTP unfortunately

)

deadringer · 08-04-2006, 10:47 AM

Wow Cubby thanks for all the update info! I've been messing around with your last release and it already looked pretty good. The only thing that baffled me was that after I got into 2007 there was no all star game scheduled. I'm sure it's an OOTP problem more than your roster set though.

In all your editing and travels in OOTP land do you have any idea how the AI actually uses the ratings to make decisions? I've noticed that on the Dodgers if you let the AI set the lineups they'll always choose to pick Garciaparra to start at short and they bench Furcal. Seanz or any other first basemen always gets the nod at first. I find this odd simply because I don't see why the AI would do this. It's not a roster problem but an AI for for sure.

CubbyFan23 · 08-04-2006, 03:44 PM

I've run into a LOT of weird AI problems.

For instance, at times the cpu will bench a guy who should be playing LF. But wait! Give him a CF rating and the game starts him in LF like they should (yes, that's not a typo).

Nomar is one instance. Another is Wilson Betemit over Renteria in Atlanta, there is numerous others that make me go nuts!

deadringer · 08-04-2006, 05:15 PM

Man I know! I started testing stuff to see where I wanted particular settings at and now I almost wished I hadn't.

There has to be something fishy about the AI and positions. In one test league I had the dodgers traded Furcal in spring training to the rockies for Y. Torrealba. This deal is a pretty crappy one but the argument could be made that the Dodger had Nomar who could play SS well enough and Navarro was lacking at C.

Later that year however, the AI showed it's ******ed side again as it decided to try to convert Kenny Lofton and Jason Repko to 1B (both failing miserably) to try and "upgrade" the lineup. So they traded a top shelf shortstop (with a big contract they could afford) for a fringe C that was barely better than they already had. Then they move two outfielders that are actually good defensively in the outfield to 1B to try and make up for the shortcomings. Beyond that, I would have thought that either Jose Cruz Jr. or Jayson Werth would have made better canidates for the switch. So they actually made a bigger hole than they had to start with.

In another test league they ended up trading a middle of the road MR and a scrub prospect to Pittsburgh for a fringy C who looked a lot like a backup or AAAA kind of guy. The AI then took the C and DFA'd his butt and released him shortly after.

The more tests I do the more I'm scared to actually play out this thing.

By the way, I'm not bagging on the rosters, they seem very realistic, just the way the AI is messing 'em up.

pompeytir · 08-04-2006, 07:29 PM

I've noticed the bugginess with the player positioning. Especially with Nomar, getting him to start at 1B.

As far as AI trades, alot of the them have been good. I've seen teams with excess starters, like the Dodgers at least trade away those players.

I've seen exchanges of minor league pitchers with similair ratings who need a 'fresh' start.

On the other hand the computer likes stock piling mediocre players. I've seen the Cardinals trade for 2 catchers and ended up with Molina as a backup and the other player to the minors. Of the 3, none of the them are very good in stat based games (real life too, Molina;x)

deadringer · 08-04-2006, 07:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pompeytir

I've noticed the bugginess with the player positioning. Especially with Nomar, getting him to start at 1B.

As far as AI trades, alot of the them have been good. I've seen teams with excess starters, like the Dodgers at least trade away those players.

I've seen exchanges of minor league pitchers with similair ratings who need a 'fresh' start.

On the other hand the computer likes stock piling mediocre players. I've seen the Cardinals trade for 2 catchers and ended up with Molina as a backup and the other player to the minors. Of the 3, none of the them are very good in stat based games (real life too, Molina;x)

Yeah, I'm not saying that all the trades have sucked but the trades where one team just releases the only guy they receive is nutty. It's like trading guys for a bag of baseballs.

CubbyFan23 · 08-05-2006, 05:08 AM

Guys, BP has been up and down all night so I haven't got as much done as I wanted. Yankees are the only AAA to do but I don't think I'm going to have time to get to them tonight so expect an afternoon release tomorrow. Sorry about the delays.

jayslick · 08-05-2006, 01:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pompeytir

On the other hand the computer likes stock piling mediocre players. I've seen the Cardinals trade for 2 catchers and ended up with Molina as a backup and the other player to the minors. Of the 3, none of the them are very good in stat based games (real life too, Molina;x)

funny you mention the stockpiling of players, i did a 2 season test to try to convert the rangers into winners. what i found was that the Trading AI pretty much allowed me to put a combo of like 4 or 5 AAAAAA players and bottom of the lineup and rotation kinda guys and get players like Justin Upton, Verlander, King Felix, etc. simply by emptying out your guys who arent every really contributers anyway, at least in the big picture.

something more interesting was that the marlins were the only team i couldnt really get to bite on that method. For sum reason, the Marlins AI seemed to value its prospects more than the other GM's AI and the Marlins kept all their prospects and were pennant winners within 2 years.

another factor i've seen is that the prospects develop really quickly who are top prospects. the marlins are a great example. the team becomes the class of the NL east in less than 3 years. i can see 4 or 5 them being a really good team. but the team is unstoppable really quick. i dont know how that has to do with the rosters, i tend to think it is the way they develop as controlled by the AI.

dont know if any of that helps just an observation.

RBA333 · 08-05-2006, 01:48 PM

i was screwing around with them a little bit as well. in one test league i started as the twins. before spring training started my rotation was santana, harden, kazmir, liriano, and verlander. this was without trading hunter, morneau, or mauer. just seemed a little easy to me to get all of these young stud SPs.

pompeytir · 08-05-2006, 02:15 PM

You can adjust the trade setting to 'Hard' or 'Very Hard' and also favor prospects.

I haven't played around with this setting too much. I'll probably check it out and see how it plays out.

jayparadise · 08-05-2006, 02:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CubbyFan23

ALSO (last thing I swear!) people are always looking for things to do, one thing I COULD use is to get some discussion on coaching sliders for coaches. I haven't touched these and obviously they're going to change the way some stats are outputted (to make them more realistic). For instance, the A's don't steal much, LaRussa loves the squeeze, etc.

I'm not sure how to do this, and might start a thread tomorrow to compile thoughts on it. This includes GMs and their preference on OBP/avg, vets/young guys, etc.

(avoid the obligatory Jim Bowden loves washed up outfield prospects because it's not an option in OOTP unfortunately

)

I think this is a great idea and I can help out if needed. In the 2005 bill james handbook, there is a whole section on managers and tendencies. Everything from lineups used, platoon %, quick and slow pitcher hooks, sac attempts and pitchouts. I have the book and if you know a way to do it, I can provide the data.

CubbyFan23 · 08-05-2006, 03:32 PM

Jay -- do you have AIM?

Haven't tested the long term viability of this whole thing really deep as far as trades and such go, I'm going to try and give it a quick run through and see if I can get you guys some modifiers before I drop the set in a bit.

hardcorebubba · 08-05-2006, 04:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CubbyFan23

Another is Wilson Betemit over Renteria in Atlanta, there is numerous others that make me go nuts!

Thats some smart AI there because Betemit should have been starting over Reneteria.

jayparadise · 08-05-2006, 04:44 PM

yeah jay2436

CubbyFan23 · 08-05-2006, 10:09 PM

File going up now.

08-04-2006, 02:07 AM	#302
pompeytir Minors (Rookie Ball) Join Date: Jun 2002 Posts: 33	Cubby, You mentioned releasing your AAA roster Thursday evening. Is that on hold now? (Friday morning now). Also, do you need help, or want to delegat some of the editing? If you have the list/changes of how you want things made; I have some free time now and for the next 10 days to help out. It beats waiting on them, sides I'm a night owl. Let me know, pompeytir@yahoo.com

08-04-2006, 03:12 AM	#303
Willmore Minors (Single A) Join Date: May 2003 Posts: 54	Still thursday over here.

08-04-2006, 04:39 AM	#304
CubbyFan23 Hall Of Famer Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: St. Louis, Missouri Posts: 2,257	It's pretty close to finished, just four teams left I think, our wireless was down all day so all I could do was clean things up here and there.

08-04-2006, 04:49 AM	#305
CubbyFan23 Hall Of Famer Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: St. Louis, Missouri Posts: 2,257	On a side note, I'm getting re-excited (is that a word?) looking over the AAA teams about the direction of this project. I think you all will be pretty satisfied with it, and there's still three or four levels to go. The depth at each level of the minors I'm hoping is something that will really make people happy, I tried to get positions for every guy that they play (although missed some here and there), pitches, pitch speeds, correct bunting, speed, stealing bases, etc. ratings all down. The good news is that the MLB/AAA levels were the hardest. I had the most information on these levels and was the most meticulous (sp) with them. While I plan on getting fairly deep at AA, in A/Low A/SS/etc. for a lot of the scrub guys there isn't much of a difference between them so I'll be mainly aiming at correct positions/speeds for guys that aren't in the top thirty-fourty prospects for a squad at lower levels. I'm going to SHOOT for tomorrow night because I still have to add managers and coaches at AAA after I finish up these last few teams. However, as usual I'm not making any promises, just where it should end up if I don't hit any setbacks which I'm not forseeing right now.

08-04-2006, 04:53 AM	#306
CubbyFan23 Hall Of Famer Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: St. Louis, Missouri Posts: 2,257	ALSO (last thing I swear!) people are always looking for things to do, one thing I COULD use is to get some discussion on coaching sliders for coaches. I haven't touched these and obviously they're going to change the way some stats are outputted (to make them more realistic). For instance, the A's don't steal much, LaRussa loves the squeeze, etc. I'm not sure how to do this, and might start a thread tomorrow to compile thoughts on it. This includes GMs and their preference on OBP/avg, vets/young guys, etc. (avoid the obligatory Jim Bowden loves washed up outfield prospects because it's not an option in OOTP unfortunately )

08-04-2006, 10:47 AM	#307
deadringer All Star Reserve Join Date: Feb 2002 Location: La Grande, Oregon Posts: 994	Wow Cubby thanks for all the update info! I've been messing around with your last release and it already looked pretty good. The only thing that baffled me was that after I got into 2007 there was no all star game scheduled. I'm sure it's an OOTP problem more than your roster set though. In all your editing and travels in OOTP land do you have any idea how the AI actually uses the ratings to make decisions? I've noticed that on the Dodgers if you let the AI set the lineups they'll always choose to pick Garciaparra to start at short and they bench Furcal. Seanz or any other first basemen always gets the nod at first. I find this odd simply because I don't see why the AI would do this. It's not a roster problem but an AI for for sure.

08-04-2006, 03:44 PM	#308
CubbyFan23 Hall Of Famer Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: St. Louis, Missouri Posts: 2,257	I've run into a LOT of weird AI problems. For instance, at times the cpu will bench a guy who should be playing LF. But wait! Give him a CF rating and the game starts him in LF like they should (yes, that's not a typo). Nomar is one instance. Another is Wilson Betemit over Renteria in Atlanta, there is numerous others that make me go nuts!

08-04-2006, 05:15 PM	#309
deadringer All Star Reserve Join Date: Feb 2002 Location: La Grande, Oregon Posts: 994	Man I know! I started testing stuff to see where I wanted particular settings at and now I almost wished I hadn't. There has to be something fishy about the AI and positions. In one test league I had the dodgers traded Furcal in spring training to the rockies for Y. Torrealba. This deal is a pretty crappy one but the argument could be made that the Dodger had Nomar who could play SS well enough and Navarro was lacking at C. Later that year however, the AI showed it's ******ed side again as it decided to try to convert Kenny Lofton and Jason Repko to 1B (both failing miserably) to try and "upgrade" the lineup. So they traded a top shelf shortstop (with a big contract they could afford) for a fringe C that was barely better than they already had. Then they move two outfielders that are actually good defensively in the outfield to 1B to try and make up for the shortcomings. Beyond that, I would have thought that either Jose Cruz Jr. or Jayson Werth would have made better canidates for the switch. So they actually made a bigger hole than they had to start with. In another test league they ended up trading a middle of the road MR and a scrub prospect to Pittsburgh for a fringy C who looked a lot like a backup or AAAA kind of guy. The AI then took the C and DFA'd his butt and released him shortly after. The more tests I do the more I'm scared to actually play out this thing. By the way, I'm not bagging on the rosters, they seem very realistic, just the way the AI is messing 'em up.

08-04-2006, 07:29 PM	#310
pompeytir Minors (Rookie Ball) Join Date: Jun 2002 Posts: 33	I've noticed the bugginess with the player positioning. Especially with Nomar, getting him to start at 1B. As far as AI trades, alot of the them have been good. I've seen teams with excess starters, like the Dodgers at least trade away those players. I've seen exchanges of minor league pitchers with similair ratings who need a 'fresh' start. On the other hand the computer likes stock piling mediocre players. I've seen the Cardinals trade for 2 catchers and ended up with Molina as a backup and the other player to the minors. Of the 3, none of the them are very good in stat based games (real life too, Molina;x)

08-05-2006, 05:08 AM	#312
CubbyFan23 Hall Of Famer Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: St. Louis, Missouri Posts: 2,257	Guys, BP has been up and down all night so I haven't got as much done as I wanted. Yankees are the only AAA to do but I don't think I'm going to have time to get to them tonight so expect an afternoon release tomorrow. Sorry about the delays.

08-05-2006, 01:48 PM	#314
RBA333 Minors (Rookie Ball) Join Date: Dec 2005 Posts: 29	i was screwing around with them a little bit as well. in one test league i started as the twins. before spring training started my rotation was santana, harden, kazmir, liriano, and verlander. this was without trading hunter, morneau, or mauer. just seemed a little easy to me to get all of these young stud SPs.

08-05-2006, 02:15 PM	#315
pompeytir Minors (Rookie Ball) Join Date: Jun 2002 Posts: 33	You can adjust the trade setting to 'Hard' or 'Very Hard' and also favor prospects. I haven't played around with this setting too much. I'll probably check it out and see how it plays out.

08-05-2006, 03:32 PM	#317
CubbyFan23 Hall Of Famer Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: St. Louis, Missouri Posts: 2,257	Jay -- do you have AIM? Haven't tested the long term viability of this whole thing really deep as far as trades and such go, I'm going to try and give it a quick run through and see if I can get you guys some modifiers before I drop the set in a bit.

08-05-2006, 04:44 PM	#319
jayparadise Bat Boy Join Date: Aug 2006 Posts: 3	yeah jay2436

08-05-2006, 10:09 PM	#320
CubbyFan23 Hall Of Famer Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: St. Louis, Missouri Posts: 2,257	File going up now.