Developer Update Thread (last update: 11/14/2013)

[Lukas Berger]

Originally Posted by Alessandro

I don't want to criticize the devs, of course, but one just has to say that this way of working by gaming companies which started from some years ago is truly ridicolous and I don't really get it. FHM is young and new titles kind of need some time, but giants like FM/GTA and other gaming companies, I don't get why in the world they get this kind of free pass with not delivering working stuff. If my work sucks I don't get paid. I don't get why buyers of mainstream games don't boycot buggy games because everytime to play FM one needs to wait for February and March. I do not play FM for a lot of years for this reason and I refuse to do that.

I absolutely agree and I've stopped buying games from quite a few companies because of that.

What I don't do, and I assume you don't do either, is haunt their forums and stalk their developers screaming repeatedly and at the top of my lungs about how they did me wrong.

It is what it is and I understand that what I may consider a boring, buggy, useless game is something that other people may legitimately feel differently about.

If I go out to dinner and pay $40 and the food isn't good, I may say something about it, but I don't stand in front of the restaurant for months later shouting at the workers and all the other customers as well. I just cross the restaurant off my list of places to go.

As for FM specifically, I agree on that too. The thing there is that I love FM so darn much that I just grin and bear it and usually wait to buy/play FM sometime in January/February.

[drewst18]

Originally Posted by omjo

Tran I look forward to buying your hockey simulator game. Oh, wait....

Folks need to chill out a bit. Yes we know the game isn't perfect but it's being worked on day in and day out to get to that level. It's not like the development team are just sitting on big recliners smoking cigars in front of a fireplace all day. They're working on fixing the issues in the game.

It's as if every game to ever come out has been perfect from day one. Guess what? FM14 just received a new patch yesterday. That brings them to 3 patches. Crazy, isn't it?

Don't even entertain him, he has alienated himself from nearly every hockey community and on his way to doing same here...

I think that everyone needs to take it easy. Both sides have said the game isn't where they want it to be. All the crap is hurting communication. If I was the devs I wouldn't be specific on what I was working on either cause if it doesn't turn out as planned its flame city.

I want the devs to feel comfortable communicating with their consumers and they can't do that if they get bitched at for every comment.

[omjo]

Originally Posted by pens66

Now it's getting comical. You look like... let's just say you don't look good with statements like that.
90% of FM14 players don't even realize the changes they made with these three patches. It's a totally different animal.

As for this back and forth between "good" guys and the "bad" guys... ah, nevermind, I'm just glad I finally read something from Jeff and Sebbi with a little more substance than posts in the last month or so. I hope it is a first step...

You totally missed my point then. I'm saying, even a company like SI has to improve their games after release. So expecting 2 guys (one apparently a rookie coder) to make a perfect game from scratch is unrealistic by some people. Not saying FM 14 is even close to the same state as FHM. Just saying some people need to chill out.

[MillerTime89]

Originally Posted by Sebastian Palkowski

The same way as with Windows, only the path to the files is different. What exactly do you want to change?

logos.... i have no idea where to start

[MillerTime89]

what steps do i need to take to apply a mod on a mac?

[drewst18]

Originally Posted by MillerTime89

what steps do i need to take to apply a mod on a mac?

Not sure how Mac's work but find your save game folder in Windows its in my documents go to Data > quick start > and select majors > graphics and put your logos in there.

[MillerTime89]

Originally Posted by drewst18

Not sure how Mac's work but find your save game folder in Windows its in my documents go to Data > quick start > and select majors > graphics and put your logos in there.

I can't even find the folder with all of that stuff using Spotlight.. I never had this issue with OOTP 14..

[Lukas Berger]

Originally Posted by MillerTime89

I can't even find the folder with all of that stuff using Spotlight.. I never had this issue with OOTP 14..

Strange. The file structures of FHM and OOTP are very similar on my PC. Unfortunately I can't help you since I know nothing about Macs Sorry!

[MillerTime89]

Is there supposed to be an option to go too under preferences on the main page?

[tran]

Originally Posted by drewst18

I think that everyone needs to take it easy. Both sides have said the game isn't where they want it to be. All the crap is hurting communication. If I was the devs I wouldn't be specific on what I was working on either cause if it doesn't turn out as planned its flame city.

I want the devs to feel comfortable communicating with their consumers and they can't do that if they get bitched at for every comment.

I deleted the personal insult, when replaying Drew
I haven't even engaged the Devs. Only people I've engaged are the people who are acting like anyone with a complaint is being whiney or petulant.

There are hardcore customers who gladly pay $40 for a product hoping to support any company working on a hockey sim.

Then there's the other 90 percent of the customers who've never been to the Blueline or Fhockey, who never played EHM.

[tran]

Originally Posted by lukasberger

I absolutely agree and I've stopped buying games from quite a few companies because of that.

What I don't do, and I assume you don't do either, is haunt their forums and stalk their developers screaming repeatedly and at the top of my lungs about how they did me wrong.

It is what it is and I understand that what I may consider a boring, buggy, useless game is something that other people may legitimately feel differently about.

If I go out to dinner and pay $40 and the food isn't good, I may say something about it, but I don't stand in front of the restaurant for months later shouting at the workers and all the other customers as well. I just cross the restaurant off my list of places to go.

As for FM specifically, I agree on that too. The thing there is that I love FM so darn much that I just grin and bear it and usually wait to buy/play FM sometime in January/February.

This is what irate customers do.
They bitch on forums.

This is generally a positive thing, because 1) it might prevent future customers from making a mistake 2) It assures other customers that, yes, indeed, it's not their computer, it's the software that's bunk.

You know, some take it too far... I saw one guy demand daily correspondence from the DEVs. I saw another guy demand info and then, when he got it, tell the Devs they shouldn't have bothered to give info when he was dissatisfied with the info.

That's all bunk.

But people should not be prevented from expressing their dissatisfaction with an unsatisfactory product.

People should not be criticized for telling the truth about this product on its foru,. People should not be discouraged from seeking answers and fixes for the game's problems.

The DEVS should show some humility. They've taken people's money and delivered substandard work.

And people are going to bitch about customers?

Get real.

The correct answer is:

Yes, we know our game doesn't meet standards. We are genuinely sorry.
Yes, here are the problems. Yes, here are the problems we are pledging to fix. Here are the problems/issues we don;t believe we can fix.

[tran]

Originally Posted by Duranium

....the umpteenth time - yes the game is somwhat unpolished - yes, one of the devs talked to us - if that´s still not enough, for god´s sake, keep on playing EHM until FHM fits your standards....

I've played enough EHM. I bought this game, to some degree, to play it.

[tran]

Originally Posted by omjo

Tran I look forward to buying your hockey simulator game. Oh, wait....

Holy moly. Because I don't design software, I shouldn't expect it to work?

[kohut]

Originally Posted by tran

Holy moly. Because I don't design software, I shouldn't expect it to work?

Sometimes make fools of themselves... the idea that because you don't design software means you shouldn't take is simply foolish.

[omjo]

Originally Posted by tran

Holy moly. Because I don't design software, I shouldn't expect it to work?

Nope.

What I was saying is, you make it sound like making a game is so easy, so I expected you to have one in the works.

My bad

[spitfire]

Originally Posted by omjo

So expecting 2 guys (one apparently a rookie coder) to make a perfect game from scratch is unrealistic by some people.

The point has been made repeatedly by several people that the FHM team is a small one with just a couple of coders. While that's certainly true, the thing I've never been able to understand is whatever possessed these guys to make their initial hockey effort a "kitchen sink" game, with multiple playable leagues, historical play, etc. It's as though they decided to make a game from scratch that rivals OOTP14 in its scope. A remarkable undertaking, and one that would have been heroic had they pulled it off. Unfortunately, they didn't. With all the stuff they've tried to include in FHM and so few people working on the game, it's no wonder that so many details large and small are still not right even after the extended beta period and the months since the game was commercially released.

Having some small amount of personal experience, I know how much work it would have taken just to put together a very basic NHL hockey sim (something like EHM freeware) that gave reasonable results and provided a framework for the layering on of detail in future versions. I can't even imagine the work involved in trying to create something as ambitious as this first release of FHM.

While I have sympathy for the designers and the enormity of the task they face in trying to get so many aspects of this game not just working but working TOGETHER to create a believable universe, I can't help but think they created a no-win situation for themselves in trying to go for the brass ring on this first release instead of starting small and growing the game into something more involved. For that reason I find I can't give them a free pass based on the size of the coding team. A small team should have known better than to try to produce a game of this scope in one big gulp. They've stated recently that no matter what decisions they take, they're going to be criticized for them. Very true. So I personally hope they might still consider taking the heat and scaling back the game for now, concentrating on getting the basics working flawlessly even if it means forsaking (for the moment) some of the other options. Realistic player development, believable stats, a basic financial model and solid AI roster management alone would be more than challenging to program even if restricted to a modern-day NHL-only environment.

[Sebastian Palkowski]

Originally Posted by MillerTime89

I can't even find the folder with all of that stuff using Spotlight.. I never had this issue with OOTP 14..

I'm not a Mac's person but the Franchise Hockey Manager 2014 folder (with the saved games in it) should be right next to the OOTP 14 one. On my Macs thats:

"User/username/Library/Application Support/Out of the Park Developments/Franchise Hockey Manager 2014/data"

Maybe other Mac user can correct me if I'm wrong?

[MillerTime89]

With OOTP 14.. there was an "add-on central" place to apply mods, whereas in the FHM, there is no such option.

[Sebastian Palkowski]

Originally Posted by MillerTime89

With OOTP 14.. there was an "add-on central" place to apply mods, whereas in the FHM, there is no such option.

FHM does not have an "add-on central", sorry. You need to copy files directly to the corresponding folders.

[MillerTime89]

I cannot locate the folders on the Mac without an "add-on central." That was the only way to do so using OOTP 14 on a mac. This is a real disappointment.. I have no way of customizing anything.