A little OOTP 11 update...

[Qwerty75]

Originally Posted by robc

Did you used to be a beta tester? You seem to have some knowledge of some of the internals.

No, but "spoke" (over IM, actually) extensively with a beta tester for BM2007/OotP8 who revealed to me some of what the beta testing team discovered about how the engine works. I would be shocked if the basics of fielding have changed since then, and they likely won't fundamentally change in this iteration. I assume it would take a complete re-write of basic game events.

The best source in the community (other than Markus, who won't reveal his cards for business reasons) for information about the way the game works when I was most active almost three versions ago was RonCo. I'm not sure if he's been supplanted as the community's guts-of-the-game guru or not.

[robc]

Originally Posted by Qwerty75

No, but "spoke" (over IM, actually) extensively with a beta tester for BM2007/OotP8 who revealed to me some of what the beta testing team discovered about how the engine works. I would be shocked if the basics of fielding have changed since then, and they likely won't fundamentally change in this iteration. I assume it would take a complete re-write of basic game events.

The best source in the community (other than Markus, who won't reveal his cards for business reasons) for information about the way the game works when I was most active almost three versions ago was RonCo. I'm not sure if he's been supplanted as the community's guts-of-the-game guru or not.

He still shows up sometimes and I think he is one of the most knowledgable and helpful people here.

[ms2002]

Originally Posted by Qwerty75

If there's a +/- score for fielding runs saved, you can get WAR by adding the +/- to VORP. Not saying that it wouldn't be nice to have the game put it together for us, but if it doesn't, all we have to do is put the two together.

I'm still skeptical that the fielding runs saved will be "fake" because of the order of events in the game engine. Sure, it's nice for game play and better than the defensive stats that exist currently in the game, but I don't think it reflects what really happens in the game engine. The game will likely take defenders' fielding ratings and assign balls to fielders after the determination of a result of a ball in play. This is illogical and not an ideal simulation of a plate appearance, which should take in to account the skills of individual fielders on a ball in play rather than the cumulative effect of the entire defensive setup.

Adding the +/- to VORP wouldn't be WAR (at least not the WAR we all know and the one that OOTP should use). WAR needs to be calculated using wOBA and significantly different positional adjustments and replacement values than OOTP currently uses.

I really hope that the extra effort is made to put the accurate WAR in OOTP. Do not use VORP in the calculations.

http://www.insidethebook.com/ee/inde...calculate_war/ (note that the positional adjustments have changed since that article was written)

[RonCo]

Thanks for the shout-out. If I had to guess, the defensive stats/zone ratings will end up being calculated along the same paths I was using in this old study of v9 defense.

http://www.thefobl.com/forums/showthread.php?t=28132

[actionjackson]

Originally Posted by Killing Time

How about everyone stops snarking at each other? Please?

Charlie's idea would trash historical play for me, but there's another way to skin this cat. If the goal is that you as a GM shouldn't know what the future value of players is then do what Le Grande Orange suggested and randomize all the player names. I took a historical league and did that and now I'm having twice the fun that I was before.

Doesn't require any changes to the game that other people wouldn't like to do that either.

Re: the bolded part. How do you randomize all the player names? If you do it in game via the functions page when each draft class is released, each player will get a different name every year - makes for some sloppy/next to impossible record keeping, not to mention 27 different aliases for one Lynn Nolan Ryan Jr. If you do it inside the player editor, you can still accidentally get some "insider information". If you change the names in the database, you have to change them again the next time you play. Am I missing something? Because this is the best possible solution I've heard yet...I just need to get it to work. Feel free to chime in if you know the answer because I'm stumped. Thanks guys.

[Jeffy25]

hey AJ!


Can't wait for this game!

[Eugene Church]

Originally Posted by mikev

pleasepleasepleasepleasepleasepleasePLEASE

give us a way to calculate WAR. PLEASE.

I hope all of you guys get WAR, UZR and all of those weird things I know nothing about... I really hope you do... but I don't use VORP, WORF, WARP, WHIP, WHIZ and things of that ilk... I just want the basic stats of baseball that we had for 100 years... that's good enough for me... as several have mentioned, most of these exotic stats are overkill, just clutter up the screens and waste hard drive space.

If those stats help Markus get more customers, I can live with them and accept them.

Just give me:

G AB R H 2B 3B HR RBI BB SO SB CS HBP BA OBP
with left/right splits.

G GS CG W-L IP H R ER HRA BB SO ERA SHO SV HBP BK
with left/right splits.

G PO A E FA DP

Actually the one new feature I wish Markus would put in the game is:

All of the basic plays that are missing from the game.
To me it is sad that a text baseball that has been around for 10 years still doesn't contain all of the routine plays you see in a ballgame.

Having said that, Markus has created a TREMENDOUS game of baseball that is truly mind boggling.

[Vinny P.]

Originally Posted by Qwerty75

No, but "spoke" (over IM, actually) extensively with a beta tester for BM2007/OotP8 who revealed to me some of what the beta testing team discovered about how the engine works. I would be shocked if the basics of fielding have changed since then, and they likely won't fundamentally change in this iteration. I assume it would take a complete re-write of basic game events.

The best source in the community (other than Markus, who won't reveal his cards for business reasons) for information about the way the game works when I was most active almost three versions ago was RonCo. I'm not sure if he's been supplanted as the community's guts-of-the-game guru or not.

Whatever happened to him? Is he still around?

[Vinny P.]

Originally Posted by RonCo

Thanks for the shout-out. If I had to guess, the defensive stats/zone ratings will end up being calculated along the same paths I was using in this old study of v9 defense.

http://www.thefobl.com/forums/showthread.php?t=28132

Oh! There you are! Guess I shoulda read further before asking that. I thought you were dead, or had a baby or something.

[Cryomaniac]

Originally Posted by Eugene Church

All of the basic plays that are missing from the game.
To me it is sad that a text baseball that has been around for 10 years still doesn't contain all of the routine plays you see in a ballgame.

Not being funny, but a list of plays that you think should be in the game that aren't would probably help Markus on this front.

[Markus Heinsohn]

Originally Posted by Qwerty75

I'm still skeptical that the fielding runs saved will be "fake" because of the order of events in the game engine. Sure, it's nice for game play and better than the defensive stats that exist currently in the game, but I don't think it reflects what really happens in the game engine. The game will likely take defenders' fielding ratings and assign balls to fielders after the determination of a result of a ball in play. This is illogical and not an ideal simulation of a plate appearance, which should take in to account the skills of individual fielders on a ball in play rather than the cumulative effect of the entire defensive setup.

I find the order of events logical. The game calculates the outcome, basing it on normal circumstances (average fielder, average fielder positioning), and then checks, using the ball location and other factors like ball speed and type which were determined initally, if the fielder or the defense positioning changes the outcome of the play. Mekes perfect sense to me.

[Markus Heinsohn]

Originally Posted by ms2002

Adding the +/- to VORP wouldn't be WAR (at least not the WAR we all know and the one that OOTP should use). WAR needs to be calculated using wOBA and significantly different positional adjustments and replacement values than OOTP currently uses.

I really hope that the extra effort is made to put the accurate WAR in OOTP. Do not use VORP in the calculations.

http://www.insidethebook.com/ee/inde...calculate_war/ (note that the positional adjustments have changed since that article was written)

I'll see if there is time left to add WAR... but it is not a high priority at the moment.

[Jeffy25]

Originally Posted by Markus Heinsohn

I'll see if there is time left to add WAR... but it is not a high priority at the moment.

WAR would make the total stat game complete IMO.

It is the only thing missing if you ask me.

Great job, keep it up........but would LOVE to see WAR added

[Qwerty75]

Originally Posted by Markus Heinsohn

I find the order of events logical. The game calculates the outcome, basing it on normal circumstances (average fielder, average fielder positioning), and then checks, using the ball location and other factors like ball speed and type which were determined initally, if the fielder or the defense positioning changes the outcome of the play. Mekes perfect sense to me.

So the ball location, speed, and type are generated at the time that the game determines there is a ball in play? Does the defensive check using the batted-ball data match the ball with a specific fielder or pair of fielders (while factoring in defensive positioning changes)?

[Markus Heinsohn]

Originally Posted by Qwerty75

So the ball location, speed, and type are generated at the time that the game determines there is a ball in play? Does the defensive check using the batted-ball data match the ball with a specific fielder or pair of fielders (while factoring in defensive positioning changes)?

It uses the specific fielder, which was selected after factoring ball location and defensive positioning.

[AESP_pres]

Markus will the calendar for the 19th century will be fix in OOTP XI? What I means is the all-star game who is always schedule (even if we uncheck the 2 options) and the season ending in July after the first expension in 1876 or 1877 (I'm not sure of wich year).

[Eugene Church]

Originally Posted by Cryomaniac

Not being funny, but a list of plays that you think should be in the game that aren't would probably help Markus on this front.

Been there, done that... several times over the past 8 years... finally gave up.

I think Markus should already know what routine plays are still not in the game, especially after 10 versions of the game.

It takes a lot of time to research the missing plays, but I will try it one more time.
The New Orleans Saints finally won the Super Bowl after 42 years. Maybe there is hope for me and the missing basic plays.

On another note, in his defense Markus said it is difficult to program rare plays in the game. I think he put 8 rare plays into OOTP10 in response to the Text Team's requests... pstrickert got him to put some rare plays in.

It's routine plays that occur with regularity that Markus needs to put in the game or say why he cannot do it.

I was hoping he would reply to my suggestion here in this thread.

[Markus Heinsohn]

Originally Posted by Eugene Church

It's routine plays that occur with regularity that Markus needs to put in the game or say why he cannot do it.

I was hoping he would reply to my suggestion here in this thread.

Lots of the routine plays that were missing in prior versions are now part of OOTP. It has constantly evolved over the years. I'd like to know which still are missing

[Malleus Dei]

Originally Posted by Markus Heinsohn

I'll see if there is time left to add WAR... but it is not a high priority at the moment.

Adding WAR is a very good idea.

[Vinny P.]

Originally Posted by Markus Heinsohn

It uses the specific fielder, which was selected after factoring ball location and defensive positioning.

Whew! Thank you! It had me worried that my star Center Fielder would be hammered due to having a crappy 1b taking the field.