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#1 |
Hall Of Famer
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: Tampa, FL USA
Posts: 4,503
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Can a clean player break the HR record and if so, will they be believed to be clean?
After reading through the various steroid threads I got to wondering if someone were to break the single season and/or all time home run records, would anyone believe they are clean?
I don't see how anyone that breaks any of the steroid aided records will ever be believed to be clean. What would a player have to do to prove to you that they were clean while breaking the records? This in my mind makes the record book pretty much useless. What does everyone else think?
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#2 |
Hall Of Famer
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: Philadelphia
Posts: 13,112
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I don't think so. I think Arod was the last clean hope, but he blew that twice. The first time when he admitted using PED's, and the second time when he showed the flaws in the testing process.
This is just me since I followed baseball the numbers 60 and 61, and 714 and 755 meant something. You heard so much about those numbers for so many years they became mythical. The single season mark was broken several times in a short period of time that I couldn't even tell you what the new mark is without looking, or total number of home runs Bonds hit. Maybe that'll change over time, but I think anybody getting close would be under suspicion - like Chris Davis was last year. |
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#3 |
Guest
Posts: n/a
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Were the original records 60 & 61 set by clean players? Can anyone prove this?
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#4 |
Major Leagues
Join Date: Oct 2011
Location: Evergreen, CO
Posts: 322
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I could see one of the Rockies doing it some day, sure, and naysayers would point to Coors Field not steroids.
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#5 |
Hall Of Famer
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: Up There
Posts: 15,644
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Well, there's always context to these numbers. Ruth's 714, for example. He lost home runs because of the rules of the time: balls which left the field of play fair but which landed foul were declared foul balls, not home runs. Bill Jenkinson (author of The Year Babe Ruth Hit 104 Home Runs) estimates that had the modern rules been applied to Ruth, he would have had an additional 75 home runs, bringing his career total to 789.
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#6 |
All Star Reserve
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: Harrisonburg VA
Posts: 765
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I'm pretty sure Ruth pumped up with beer and hot dogs.
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"Sometimes the magic works and sometimes it doesn't." |
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#7 | |
Major Leagues
Join Date: Apr 2002
Location: Fort Worth, TX
Posts: 348
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Quote:
There is no doubt that players are getting bigger and stronger with each new generation. To my knowledge Josh Hamilton never juiced, or if he did it was well before his time with the Rangers, the same with Pujols and they both have/had the power to hit well over 70. If there is a number that may be unattainable it could be 300 wins. In fact I am almost certain a closer will reach 500 saves before a starter gets to 300 wins. |
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#8 | |
All Star Reserve
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: Harrisonburg VA
Posts: 765
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Quote:
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"Sometimes the magic works and sometimes it doesn't." |
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#9 |
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Aside from the fact he hit all of those homeruns against pitching that had not developed 90% of the pitches they used today against a talent pool that was about 10% of that of today (both big * for me) he also experimented with PED's.
But, I love the little hot dog and beer line. Never heard that one before. ![]() |
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#10 | |
Hall Of Famer
Join Date: Aug 2002
Posts: 3,329
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Quote:
Maris hit 61 in the early 60s so I don't know what they had at that time. But whatever it was, it didn't have the same affect on the body as Maris didn't look all that pumped up. |
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#11 | ||
All Star Reserve
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: Harrisonburg VA
Posts: 765
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Quote:
So much is different between now and 1927. Besides what you rightly noted, there were only 8 teams in each league, so a given pitcher and hitter saw each other A LOT. There were no night games. Baseballs were hardly ever thrown out of games. Travel conditions were hugely different. Training and conditioning were worlds apart. This is why records (heresy alert ![]() Quote:
![]() In sum, it's all good.
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"Sometimes the magic works and sometimes it doesn't." |
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#12 |
Hall Of Famer
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: Up There
Posts: 15,644
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#13 |
Hall Of Famer
Join Date: Aug 2002
Posts: 3,329
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#14 |
Major Leagues
Join Date: Apr 2007
Posts: 379
Infractions: 0/1 (1)
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#15 | |
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Posts: n/a
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Quote:
Then he played in Comiskey, Fenway, Tiger Stadium. Babe Ruth is like that fish you caught when no one was with you. The legend just grows a little each year. He would be Cecil Fielder if he played today. |
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#16 | |
All Star Reserve
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: Harrisonburg VA
Posts: 765
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Quote:
Tigers Stadium (Briggs Stadium when I was a kid) and Fenway were really good parks to hit in. Babe Ruth was a much better pitcher than Cecil Fielder.
__________________
"Sometimes the magic works and sometimes it doesn't." |
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#17 |
Hall Of Famer
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: Minnesota
Posts: 3,481
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Perhaps this is true but it cant be proved and maybe Ruth would have taken advantage of todays technology to improve his game. Who knows?
Comparing one of the best hitters in baseball history to Cecil Fielder is just wrong. We have plenty of numbers to compare era's now and Ruth still comes out as one of the 3 best of all time. |
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#18 | ||
Hall Of Famer
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: Up There
Posts: 15,644
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Quote:
Left Field: 255, 280.58 (1924); 301 (1928) Left Field: left side of bullpen gate in short left field 395, 402 (1928); right side of bullpen gate 415 (1937) Left Center: 474, 461 (1924); 451 (1937) Deepest Left Center (left of dead center): 500, 490 (1924), 461 (1937) Center Field left side of screen: 466 (1937) Center Field: 487, 470 (1924), 449 (1937) Left of Right Center: 423, 417 (1924), 407 (1937) Right Center: 423, 417 (1924), 407 (1937) Right Field: left side of bullpen gate 367 (1937); right side of bullpen gate 344 (1937) Right Field: 255, 295 (1924), 296 (1930) You can see overhead diagrams of the original Yankee Stadium at Clem's Baseball. Take a look at the park's shape in 1923 and 1928. Then there's this from the preface of Green Cathedrals: Quote:
Last edited by Le Grande Orange; 01-26-2014 at 03:28 AM. |
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#19 |
Major Leagues
Join Date: Dec 2009
Posts: 359
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Beside, Ruth hit more HR [I]away[I]from home (in less game, too)
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#20 | |
Hall Of Famer
Join Date: Feb 2012
Location: Inside The Game
Posts: 30,937
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Quote:
Babe Ruth Career Home Runs - Baseball-Reference.com Barry Bonds Career Home Runs - Baseball-Reference.com
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Go today don't wait for tomorrow It isn't promised, all the time you get borrowed Don't live your life for other people Don't bottle your emotions till they crack and fill a couple just sorrows Take your mind and refocus go get a paper write your goals out Throw your middle fingers to all your haters "Stay Strong" ![]() |
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