Test League: 25 years of stats, stats, and more stats (lots of screenshots included)

[Caporegime]

Originally Posted by philliesphan26

Here he is. Had a bit of a pop to his swing, managed a 20 HR season once. Decent gap hitter. Not as fast as expected, but above average. A victim of the shortened career, only played in the Majors from 2016-2028. 9 hits shy of 2000, who knows what would have happened if he didn't decline so rapidly...

Wow! He bottomed out fast. What caused such a rapid decline in his skills? Usually, great contact hitters (and this guy is legendary) decline a bit more gracefully than that.

[jaa36]

Originally Posted by philliesphan26

Nice! Looks good man. Though lots of the single season records are from very early on... Makes the need to delete the history after a decade or so even more needed. Otherwise I like it. What were your player development and aging modifiers?

PCMs and aging were default. I usually create more trouble than I fix when I try messing with those.

[philliesphan26]

Originally Posted by Caporegime

Wow! He bottomed out fast. What caused such a rapid decline in his skills? Usually, great contact hitters (and this guy is legendary) decline a bit more gracefully than that.

Yeah I'm not quite sure. He went from guaranteed .300+ hitter to out of the league in a span of 2 years. He was injury riddled his last few years and always had lingering minor injuries throughout. I'm sure they played a role

[bschr682]

Originally Posted by philliesphan26

Wow great post man. The graphs really do say it all, and it backs up what beorn was saying earlier.

So perhaps an ever so slight boost the hitter PCM's and we'd be golden? I'm never sure how much of an alteration is required to make a small but noticeable difference.

[philliesphan26]

Originally Posted by bschr682

So perhaps an ever so slight boost the hitter PCM's and we'd be golden? I'm never sure how much of an alteration is required to make a small but noticeable difference.

It would appear so. I've never tinkered with them to know better. I'll try to run some test leagues tomorrow and tinker with them then. I'd like to see the rare 20 year career every now and then. Others have probably found PCMs that work for them and I'd love to hear what people run with if it gives them success

[bschr682]

Not to get off topic here but I have always wondered what would happen if a person were to increase all the PCMS across the board the same amount? would that cause no real effect to the league totals and just basicly change the cosmetics of the league.

i.e. good OBP guys instead of averaging an 8 contact/8 eye would be averaging 9 contact/9 eye? I wonder because personally I don't like the way the ratings look in OOTP.

[byzeil]

The league that I used for the comparison test is setup using Feeder Leagues. 1 Collkege, 1 Junior College and 1 High School league.

At the end of the 31 year sim in OOTP I have gone through the '100 Top Prospects', 'Top 20 Hitters', 'Top 20 Pitchers', and I checked the top 38 major leaguers (200 pa ranked by OPS+ for hitters and 80ip ranked by ERA+). This has show me something disturbing for my setup.

33 of Top 100 Prospects are from the Feeder Leagues, 77 from International.
6 of the 40 ML Players from the Top 20 Hit and Pit are from Feeder Leagues
6 of the 38 Top ML hitters (by OPS+) are from Feeders
5 of the 38 Top ML Pitchers (by ERA+) are from Feeders

So the majority of the talent coming into the league is from International Sources, the Ammy draft is almost inconsequential.

Next I have to check the OOTP13 league for these same things and try to determine if it is my setup or something to do with OOTP14.

[byzeil]

Originally Posted by byzeil

The league that I used for the comparison test is setup using Feeder Leagues. 1 Collkege, 1 Junior College and 1 High School league.

At the end of the 31 year sim in OOTP I have gone through the '100 Top Prospects', 'Top 20 Hitters', 'Top 20 Pitchers', and I checked the top 38 major leaguers (200 pa ranked by OPS+ for hitters and 80ip ranked by ERA+). This has show me something disturbing for my setup.

This is OOTP14

33 of Top 100 Prospects are from the Feeder Leagues, 77 from International.
6 of the 40 ML Players from the Top 20 Hit and Pit are from Feeder Leagues
6 of the 38 Top ML hitters (by OPS+) are from Feeders
5 of the 38 Top ML Pitchers (by ERA+) are from Feeders

So the majority of the talent coming into the league is from International Sources, the Ammy draft is almost inconsequential.

Next I have to check the OOTP13 league for these same things and try to determine if it is my setup or something to do with OOTP14.

Here are the same numbers as above from the OOTP13 version of the league

74 of Top 100 Prospects are from the Feeder Leagues
24 of the 40 ML Players from the Top 20 Hit and Pit are from Feeder Leagues
23 of the 38 Top ML hitters (by OPS+) are from Feeders
26 of the 38 Top ML Pitchers (by ERA+) are from Feeders

These numbers are much more like what I am looking for. From this data it looks like OOTP14 produces much better talent from International sources as compared to Feeder Leagues.

[JMDurron]

Originally Posted by byzeil

Here are the same numbers as above from the OOTP13 version of the league

74 of Top 100 Prospects are from the Feeder Leagues
24 of the 40 ML Players from the Top 20 Hit and Pit are from Feeder Leagues
23 of the 38 Top ML hitters (by OPS+) are from Feeders
26 of the 38 Top ML Pitchers (by ERA+) are from Feeders

These numbers are much more like what I am looking for. From this data it looks like OOTP14 produces much better talent from International sources as compared to Feeder Leagues.

The question now becomes whether this is due to a problem with your Feeders being underpowered, or with the International sources being overpowered. If it's the former, there might be a league-specific problem of some kind with your feeder setup. If it's the latter, then this might be a problem for everyone.

[jaa36]

Just checked my league, and 58 of the top 100 prospects came from international sources- 42 from feeder leagues.

Best I can tell, of the MLB.com top 100 prospects in real life, 23 come from international sources and 77 from the draft. So I would agree that OOTP is producing more talent than I'd like from international sources in my league as well. I think I'll dial down the frequency of player finds a bit...

[rudel.dietrich]

This is great stuff

Since version 8 I have used a custom built Excel spread sheet that I used in almost all of my leagues. I import my league totals into it and then use the formula and ever year it modifies the league totals from 0.0-4.5%
I also have some of the totals linked so if one of the batting totals change then there is a better chance that the other batting totals will change in the same direction.
And I have gone as far as to add the ability for it to simulate eras where the totals will swing one direction and each year the % chance to continue in that direction increases. Once a certain number of years is reached, then there is a decreasing likely hood that it will continue in that direction and it will begin to swing back the other way.

Good stuff though people. Version 14 seems to be a lot more stable out of the gate in terms of maintaining long term statistical output.
In years past, especially in fictional leagues it would drive me to fits of cursing when my leagues would suddenly spin out of control and the league batting averages would be over .315 and league ERA would be over 5.00.

[rudel.dietrich]

Originally Posted by philliesphan26

Great player, but that uniform makes my eyes bleed

[byzeil]

Originally Posted by JMDurron

The question now becomes whether this is due to a problem with your Feeders being underpowered, or with the International sources being overpowered. If it's the former, there might be a league-specific problem of some kind with your feeder setup. If it's the latter, then this might be a problem for everyone.

It could be my feeder setup but then OOTP14 is handling my Feeder leagues differently than OOTP13 did because all I did was import my v13 into v14 and I changed nothing in either version. After the 31 year sim International players are much better compared to feeder players in v14 compared to v13 in this league.

[Markus Heinsohn]

On default, the game creates players that model 2013 real major league numbers and maintains these pretty closely into the future. Of course, depending on league size, things may trend in one way or the other, but on average they stay close.

All our tests show that this part of the game is working great and as designed

[Markus Heinsohn]

Originally Posted by byzeil

The league that I used for the comparison test is setup using Feeder Leagues. 1 Collkege, 1 Junior College and 1 High School league.

At the end of the 31 year sim in OOTP I have gone through the '100 Top Prospects', 'Top 20 Hitters', 'Top 20 Pitchers', and I checked the top 38 major leaguers (200 pa ranked by OPS+ for hitters and 80ip ranked by ERA+). This has show me something disturbing for my setup.

33 of Top 100 Prospects are from the Feeder Leagues, 77 from International.
6 of the 40 ML Players from the Top 20 Hit and Pit are from Feeder Leagues
6 of the 38 Top ML hitters (by OPS+) are from Feeders
5 of the 38 Top ML Pitchers (by ERA+) are from Feeders

So the majority of the talent coming into the league is from International Sources, the Ammy draft is almost inconsequential.

Next I have to check the OOTP13 league for these same things and try to determine if it is my setup or something to do with OOTP14.

Then you may want to set the frequency of scouting discoveries and international amateur FA to "less" for your specific league setup.

[philliesphan26]

Originally Posted by rudel.dietrich

Great player, but that uniform makes my eyes bleed

Haha yeah... I didn't touch anything with the teams in this league (kept all unis/cities/nicknames as they were generated) but I think there's something wrong with my jerseys folder in OOTP 14. I was tinkering with it before I noticed the issue so I certainly did created the issue myself, but never bothered to investigate the issue since I import jersey mods anyway and custom upload each team's for my real leagues... So all the teams' default jerseys look like that now before I change them, if that makes sense

Originally Posted by byzeil

Here are the same numbers as above from the OOTP13 version of the league

74 of Top 100 Prospects are from the Feeder Leagues
24 of the 40 ML Players from the Top 20 Hit and Pit are from Feeder Leagues
23 of the 38 Top ML hitters (by OPS+) are from Feeders
26 of the 38 Top ML Pitchers (by ERA+) are from Feeders

These numbers are much more like what I am looking for. From this data it looks like OOTP14 produces much better talent from International sources as compared to Feeder Leagues.

This discussion turned quickly! Not that I have an issue with it of course... I think it raises a valid point. As Markus mentioned, some testing may have to be done with the talent finding on "Less" as opposed to "Default" to see if that helps. I didn't use feeder leagues in this test league however, just default randomly generated amateur pools.

Originally Posted by Markus Heinsohn

On default, the game creates players that model 2013 real major league numbers and maintains these pretty closely into the future. Of course, depending on league size, things may trend in one way or the other, but on average they stay close.

All our tests show that this part of the game is working great and as designed

I do recall you saying you did hundreds of test leagues so I knew that the default settings wouldn't be creating any loopy results. But it was nice to uncover the differences in importing an OOTP 13 league over as opposed to starting a new league from scratch in OOTP 14, or the potential international amateur talent overload with feeders and default amateur talent settings. I always love seeing this type of discussion unfold, which is what fueled my desire to start this post to begin with, though it did take turns that even I wasn't expecting

[byzeil]

Originally Posted by Markus Heinsohn

Then you may want to set the frequency of scouting discoveries and international amateur FA to "less" for your specific league setup.

Ok, that actually makes since because my test league is only a 16 team league and I'm guessing the default 'frequency' is setup up for a full major league setup. Didn't think of that. I will adjust those numbers and run another test and wiill post the results wen I'm done.

[jaa36]

Although- the international scouting discoveries are relative to the size of the league, so this shouldn't be the issue. Regardless, I cut the frequency to "low," which resulted (after a 15 year sim) in 40 of the top 100 prospects coming from foreign sources- better, but still not as low as I'd want it. My next step may be increasing the number of feeder teams (though I'm already at the recommended number) to see if this increases the talent coming in through the draft.

[byzeil]

Originally Posted by jaa36

Although- the international scouting discoveries are relative to the size of the league, so this shouldn't be the issue. Regardless, I cut the frequency to "low," which resulted (after a 15 year sim) in 40 of the top 100 prospects coming from foreign sources- better, but still not as low as I'd want it. My next step may be increasing the number of feeder teams (though I'm already at the recommended number) to see if this increases the talent coming in through the draft.

The international scouting discoveries is per team so that should not be the issue.

But the international established Fa, independent league FA and the Amateur international fa (the ones that you must offer bonuses to plus this is where the real international talent seems to come from) are league wide and probably tested for a 30 MLB setup. I'm cut each of those to the next lowest level and am running the 31 year sim again. If these levels are still too high I can lower them again. I'd like to get to a 75% Feeder league/ 24% international split if I can.

[Manny42]

Originally Posted by byzeil

The international scouting discoveries is per team so that should not be the issue.

But the international established Fa, independent league FA and the Amateur international fa (the ones that you must offer bonuses to plus this is where the real international talent seems to come from) are league wide and probably tested for a 30 MLB setup. I'm cut each of those to the next lowest level and am running the 31 year sim again. If these levels are still too high I can lower them again. I'd like to get to a 75% Feeder league/ 24% international split if I can.

I'd love to see the results from this as that's the kind of ratio I'd love as well for my legue when I get it up and running