2008 Seattle Mariners -- What Happened? - Page 4

Boom Boom · 07-19-2008, 02:15 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by daotis

I think we can all blame Bill Bavasi for making such ******ed and illogical moves. I mean, how did that guy ever get into the front office? For the past five years he has been digging this franchise a hole that we are now forced to climb out of. Thankfully we can at least start now that he's gone.

Let's just hope their fate doesn't resemble that of the sonics...

Oh it won't, the mariners still make a lot of money.

What I am concerned thou is Vidro getting any more abats, if he does than it automatically gives him a phat contract next season.

Michael Hopcroft · 07-21-2008, 06:43 PM

Well, the M's get to see the Red Sox for three days in Safeco this week. I wonder how bad the losses are going to be.

messenjah · 07-21-2008, 11:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by daotis

I think we can all blame Bill Bavasi for making such ******ed and illogical moves. I mean, how did that guy ever get into the front office? For the past five years he has been digging this franchise a hole that we are now forced to climb out of. Thankfully we can at least start now that he's gone.

Let's just hope their fate doesn't resemble that of the sonics...

Fortunately, Safeco field is and will be a money cow for a while yet. Even if the team is horrible fans will show up and we aren't leaving anytime soon. If we do get competent leadership, that financial strength+owners willing to spend should give us a leg up in the division. If only we can get someone to spend all that money wisely.

Syd Thrift · 07-22-2008, 03:01 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Michael Hopcroft

Well, the M's get to see the Red Sox for three days in Safeco this week. I wonder how bad the losses are going to be.

4-0 loss tonight, although I have to say... I went as a reward for doing good deeds for my (really big) company and they put me up in the All-Star Club suite, which is about as awesome a baseball experience as you can imagine.

Boom Boom · 07-22-2008, 02:36 PM

Since Steve Balmer it out of trying to by the Sonics, maybe he can buy the Mariners

messenjah · 07-22-2008, 03:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Boom Boom

Since Steve Balmer it out of trying to by the Sonics, maybe he can buy the Mariners

I don't know if our ownership is the problem. Ownership seems more than willing to spend our luxurious resources towards winning, and many would say that the Mariners have some of the best, hands off owners in the league. I really think it comes down to a shift in philosophy for Lincoln, Armstrong and whoever our new GM is. I don't think that those two need to get fired, but they need to revamp how they look at team building. We are slowly becoming the laughingstock of baseball because as teams move more towards 21st century management, we're still stuck in the 19th century.

Full0fnasty · 07-22-2008, 03:13 PM

What happened to our Mariners was Bill Bavasi. Since he came to the Mariners he pretty much did nothing but squander money out to players that he shouldn't have (although I am a huge Beltre fan)....I knew the Sexson deal was crap even before it happened and his inability to make good deals, or any deals of relevance for that matter hurt us. He wasted good opportunities to get stuff done during the off-seasons and really didn't show good skills at doing his job at all.

billethius · 07-22-2008, 03:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Syd Thrift

4-0 loss tonight, although I have to say... I went as a reward for doing good deeds for my (really big) company and they put me up in the All-Star Club suite, which is about as awesome a baseball experience as you can imagine.

I've never been in a suite at Safeco, but I have sat in the diamond club a handful of times and it's incredible. The only thing I didn't like about it was that for most of the people, having those seats is a status symbol and most of them don't follow baseball at all.

Boom Boom · 07-22-2008, 03:31 PM

As for Bavasi, I think his single worse trade ever was the Rafael Sorriano Trade... Bavasi will go down as the worse GM in Seattle history.

JWay · 07-22-2008, 06:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Boom Boom

As for Bavasi, I think his single worse trade ever was the Rafael Sorriano Trade... Bavasi will go down as the worse GM in Seattle history.

over the Carlos Gullien for Ramon santaigo? you're crazy

Boom Boom · 07-25-2008, 02:20 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JWay

over the Carlos Gullien for Ramon santaigo? you're crazy

Their are way to many bad moves by Bavasi...

JWay · 07-25-2008, 02:29 AM

very much so agreed.

Luis_Rivera · 07-25-2008, 02:31 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Full0fnasty

(although I am a huge Beltre fan)

You should be... he's been well worth his contract. It's the high expectations set by his 2004 that makes people think he was a bust.

rem · 07-25-2008, 02:57 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Luis_Rivera

You should be... he's been well worth his contract. It's the high expectations set by his 2004 that makes people think he was a bust.

Come on, his OBPs are .303/.328/.319/.330. Even adjusting for park his OPS+s are 93, 105, 112, 107. That's not worth 11/12M a year.

Boom Boom · 07-25-2008, 09:19 AM

His defense is amazing, you can throw any statistic out there at me. Beltre is worth the contract. He is one hell of a player.

jdettbarn · 07-25-2008, 10:46 AM

What I don't understand is how come I keep seeing rumors that the Ms are trying to attach Vidro to any deal they make (I've seen him mentioned with Washburn and Ibanez on MLBtraderumors.com)... even ESPN was reporting that the Ms were actively seeking to include Vidro in their deals. WTF?!

It's confusing because:
A) Riggleman was just quoted as saying he liked Vidro as the DH. (FIRE JOE MORGAN: Jim Riggleman Has Superhero-Level Powers Of Self-Deception)
and
B) Vidro's contract is up at the end of the year, provided be doesn't reach the 600 PA level to trigger an extension. JUST STOP PLAYING HIM AND HE WILL GO AWAY!

It's ridiculously stupid because all the rumors have the Ms getting back lower quality players due to them dumping salary. So, given B, if I was a competing GM I'd say heck yeah we'll give you a B or C level prospect and take on Vidro! Then just have him pinch hit occassionally and buy him out at the end of the year.

Not to mention the best option of all. RELEASE HIM! He's a waste of space on the (any) roster.

How many other teams are stupid enough to keep playing guys like Vidro and his 66 OPS+ AND keep hitting him in the top 5 of the order. And that isn't even mentioning their affinity to Cairo and his 61 OPS+ who regularly hits in the #2 spot. They move guys up though! And can do the hit and run. And can bunt! Just what we need.

Seriously. I wonder why I still like this team... at least it's not boring to be a fan. Always something to complain about!

Next up: Riggleman and Pelekoudas get extensions!

Boom Boom · 07-26-2008, 10:18 PM

Vidro isn't problem, the problem is that there is nobody better than him to play. The Mariners roster sucks! Vidro would still be valuable in the national league (lesser league) but his defense is soo bad.

I don't mind if Vidro is on the Mariners next season...for less money and playing off the bench.

JWay · 07-27-2008, 01:18 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Boom Boom

Vidro isn't problem, the problem is that there is nobody better than him to play. The Mariners roster sucks! Vidro would still be valuable in the national league (lesser league) but his defense is soo bad.

I don't mind if Vidro is on the Mariners next season...for less money and playing off the bench.

Vidro being the worst hitter in MLB, and being out hit by pitchers (including Felix Hernadez

) probably means that he's just not very good. Do we have someone better to be DH? maybe not. But that doesn't mean we have to bat him 4th in the line up do we?

We'd be better off bringing back Edgar.

darkenigma510 · 07-27-2008, 09:34 AM

It wasn't until I popped into this thread that I realized how bad it truly was for you guys.

Boom Boom · 07-27-2008, 12:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JWay

Vidro being the worst hitter in MLB, and being out hit by pitchers (including Felix Hernadez

) probably means that he's just not very good. Do we have someone better to be DH? maybe not. But that doesn't mean we have to bat him 4th in the line up do we?

We'd be better off bringing back Edgar.

I agree with that. Riggleman thinks Vidro adds protection to Ibanez, Beltre or whoever bats 3rd. Vidro should be on the bench, and maybe add some youth in the lineup. Put Johima at 1st base, Clement at catcher...Ibanez at DH, Balentine in LF....that is just a start...the other thing we could do is bring up Tui (but I heard he got hurt??)

07-25-2008, 10:46 AM	#76
jdettbarn All Star Reserve Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Buffalo, NY Posts: 635	What I don't understand is how come I keep seeing rumors that the Ms are trying to attach Vidro to any deal they make (I've seen him mentioned with Washburn and Ibanez on MLBtraderumors.com)... even ESPN was reporting that the Ms were actively seeking to include Vidro in their deals. WTF?! It's confusing because: A) Riggleman was just quoted as saying he liked Vidro as the DH. (FIRE JOE MORGAN: Jim Riggleman Has Superhero-Level Powers Of Self-Deception) and B) Vidro's contract is up at the end of the year, provided be doesn't reach the 600 PA level to trigger an extension. JUST STOP PLAYING HIM AND HE WILL GO AWAY! It's ridiculously stupid because all the rumors have the Ms getting back lower quality players due to them dumping salary. So, given B, if I was a competing GM I'd say heck yeah we'll give you a B or C level prospect and take on Vidro! Then just have him pinch hit occassionally and buy him out at the end of the year. Not to mention the best option of all. RELEASE HIM! He's a waste of space on the (any) roster. How many other teams are stupid enough to keep playing guys like Vidro and his 66 OPS+ AND keep hitting him in the top 5 of the order. And that isn't even mentioning their affinity to Cairo and his 61 OPS+ who regularly hits in the #2 spot. They move guys up though! And can do the hit and run. And can bunt! Just what we need. Seriously. I wonder why I still like this team... at least it's not boring to be a fan. Always something to complain about! Next up: Riggleman and Pelekoudas get extensions! __________________ NPBL Idaho Spuds GM Former Federal Baseball League and JOBL Commish (2002 - 2011)

07-21-2008, 06:43 PM	#62
Michael Hopcroft Major Leagues Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: Portland, OR USA Posts: 487	Well, the M's get to see the Red Sox for three days in Safeco this week. I wonder how bad the losses are going to be.

07-22-2008, 02:36 PM	#65
Boom Boom Major Leagues Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: Issaquah, WA Posts: 361	Since Steve Balmer it out of trying to by the Sonics, maybe he can buy the Mariners

07-22-2008, 03:13 PM	#67
Full0fnasty Minors (Rookie Ball) Join Date: Jun 2007 Posts: 23	What happened to our Mariners was Bill Bavasi. Since he came to the Mariners he pretty much did nothing but squander money out to players that he shouldn't have (although I am a huge Beltre fan)....I knew the Sexson deal was crap even before it happened and his inability to make good deals, or any deals of relevance for that matter hurt us. He wasted good opportunities to get stuff done during the off-seasons and really didn't show good skills at doing his job at all.

07-22-2008, 03:31 PM	#69
Boom Boom Major Leagues Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: Issaquah, WA Posts: 361	As for Bavasi, I think his single worse trade ever was the Rafael Sorriano Trade... Bavasi will go down as the worse GM in Seattle history.

07-25-2008, 02:29 AM	#72
JWay Hall Of Famer Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: Sioux Falls, SD Posts: 5,021	very much so agreed.

07-25-2008, 09:19 AM	#75
Boom Boom Major Leagues Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: Issaquah, WA Posts: 361	His defense is amazing, you can throw any statistic out there at me. Beltre is worth the contract. He is one hell of a player.

07-26-2008, 10:18 PM	#77
Boom Boom Major Leagues Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: Issaquah, WA Posts: 361	Vidro isn't problem, the problem is that there is nobody better than him to play. The Mariners roster sucks! Vidro would still be valuable in the national league (lesser league) but his defense is soo bad. I don't mind if Vidro is on the Mariners next season...for less money and playing off the bench.

07-27-2008, 09:34 AM	#79
darkenigma510 All Star Starter Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: The Wild West Posts: 1,353	It wasn't until I popped into this thread that I realized how bad it truly was for you guys.