Did Rogers Cheat - Page 9

dsvitak · 10-23-2006, 06:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JDOldSchool

... Did Rogers (likely unknowingly) utilize that loophole? Seems that way.

This is astounding...he UNKNOWINGLY cheated? On a loophole?

IF IT WASN'T DIRT, THEN IT MUST HAVE BEEN A FOREIGN SUBSTANCE.

FOREIGN SUBSTANCES ARE ILLEGAL. ALL OF THEM.

HE CHEATED, AND GOT CAUGHT.

Bay Area Bob · 10-23-2006, 07:00 PM

woohoo!!!!11 CAPS TO PROVE TEH ACCRSEE

magnet · 10-23-2006, 07:01 PM

What if it was fecal matter? Wouldn't you all feel like jackasses if Rogers has explosive diarrhea?

dsvitak · 10-23-2006, 07:02 PM

Breaking news, on the Fox 2 news affiliate in St. Louis.

Tony LaRussa was just asked what was on Roger's hand, and he said, and I'll quote:

"IT WASN'T DIRT."

AnotherAlias · 10-23-2006, 07:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JDOldSchool

Touch pine tar. Touch something else with it. That's all the proof you'll need.

I have. Many times. I played some semi-pro ball and we used it all the time. On cold days it helps with the grip on the ball. It doesn't necessarily transfer onto the ball, but it is a foreign substance and is quite illegal to use on the mound.

Sadly, we'll never know exactly what it was on his hand because they let him off the hook.

Quote:

Originally Posted by JDOldSchool

So? What's your point? I'm not seeing how this is relevant to the rule exception and what I have been saying.

My point is that there is a precedence. It isn't the first time a pitcher has been caught using pine tar to help with his grip of the ball on the mound.

CONN CHRIS · 10-23-2006, 07:03 PM

I understand that this is a heated discussion, but let's leave comments suggesting suicide and other personal attacks out of this.

Bay area Bob self-edited his comment, dsvitak needs to do the same where he quoted the pre-edited post. And yes that means a warning may well be in the offing.

JDOldSchool · 10-23-2006, 07:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dsvitak

This is astounding...he UNKNOWINGLY cheated? On a loophole?

IF IT WASN'T DIRT, THEN IT MUST HAVE BEEN A FOREIGN SUBSTANCE.

FOREIGN SUBSTANCES ARE ILLEGAL. ALL OF THEM.

HE CHEATED, AND GOT CAUGHT.

Your typing and spelling skills are tremendous for someone incapable of reading comprehension.

First of all, I didn't say he unknowingly cheated. I said he did something that happens to not be illegal, though he probably thought it was. More like he unknowingly didn't cheat on a loophole that is in the rulebook. It was posted here twice. You haven't read it either time.

Foreign substances, under that rule exception, are not all illegal. Please, try to understand that.

Bay Area Bob · 10-23-2006, 07:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dsvitak

Breaking news, on the Fox 2 news affiliate in St. Louis.

Tony LaRussa was just asked what was on Roger's hand, and he said, and I'll quote:

"IT WASN'T DIRT."

TONY LARUSSA: BASTION OF UNBIASED, EXPERT SUBSTANCE ON HAND OPINION

AnotherAlias · 10-23-2006, 07:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by magnet

What if it was fecal matter? Wouldn't you all feel like jackasses if Rogers has explosive diarrhea?

Only if it's a chronic case.

andymac · 10-23-2006, 07:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dsvitak

Sure, a large number of things, last night, game 3 of the ALCS, AND a July 20th start against the White Sox.

Sure, completely reasonable.

Go ahead and provide a REASONABLE explanation.

Um, his palm sweats causing the rosin to gunk up, he tends to rub that part of his hand against his dirty cap causing dirt to come off onto it, etc. There are ar ton of viable explanations. The fact is there is no way to prove that it is or isn't pine tar because we do not physically have the substance in front of us to examine. So, at this point we have to accept what the umpires have stated and it is pointless to do anything else.

I would be it isn't a reach to guess that you were on the other side of this argument a couple of seasons ago when Julian Tavarez was tossed and suspended for a substance that was on his cap which the umpire couldn't identify but said "could have included" pine tar. In this case the umpire either determined it wasn't illegal or the substance was gone before he could check it. Either way, we can't know for sure and it is pretty dumb to claim that we do.

dsvitak · 10-23-2006, 07:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bay Area Bob

TONY LARUSSA: BASTION OF UNBIASED, EXPERT SUBSTANCE ON HAND OPINION

There's your answer. It wasn't dirt.

I trust Tony LaRussa completely in this....he has absolutely no reason not to tell the truth here.

dsvitak · 10-23-2006, 07:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by andymac

Um, his palm sweats causing the rosin to gunk up, he tends to rub that part of his hand against his dirty cap causing dirt to come off onto it, etc. There are ar ton of viable explanations. The fact is there is no way to prove that it is or isn't pine tar because we do not physically have the substance in front of us to examine. So, at this point we have to accept what the umpires have stated and it is pointless to do anything else.

I would be it isn't a reach to guess that you were on the other side of this argument a couple of seasons ago when Julian Tavarez was tossed and suspended for a substance that was on his cap which the umpire couldn't identify but said "could have included" pine tar. In this case the umpire either determined it wasn't illegal or the substance was gone before he could check it. Either way, we can't know for sure and it is pretty dumb to claim that we do.

Sure, this works...he is the ONLY PITCHER IN BASEBALL HISTORY TO BE AFFECTED IN THIS FASHION.

Ummmm......no.

Bay Area Bob · 10-23-2006, 07:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dsvitak

There's your answer. It wasn't dirt.

I trust Tony LaRussa completely in this....he has absolutely no reason not to tell the truth here.

WHY ARE YOU USING SARCASM TO FURTHER THE ARGUMENT OF YOUR OPPONENTS IN THIS HEATED DISCUSSION

magnet · 10-23-2006, 07:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dsvitak

There's your answer. It wasn't dirt.

I trust Tony LaRussa completely in this....he has absolutely no reason not to tell the truth here.

Uhm, to get the media to rally around his team? Maybe to get the Detroit fans to boo Rogers in Game 6?

JDOldSchool · 10-23-2006, 07:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by AnotherAlias

I have. Many times. I played some semi-pro ball and we used it all the time. On cold days it helps with the grip on the ball. It doesn't necessarily transfer onto the ball, but it is a foreign substance and is quite illegal to use on the mound.

Sadly, we'll never know exactly what it was on his hand because they let him off the hook.

I know it is, because it alters the ball. And applying something to the HAND is not the same according to the rulebook as applying it to the ball.

There is no way that was pine tar unless it transfered to the ball. There's just no way.

Quote:

My point is that there is a precedence. It isn't the first time a pitcher has been caught using pine tar to help with his grip of the ball on the mound.

Pine tar helps breaking balls break better. That's different than what I'm saying.

CONN CHRIS · 10-23-2006, 07:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dsvitak

Sure, this works...he is the ONLY PITCHER IN BASEBALL HISTORY TO BE AFFECTED IN THIS FASHION.

Ummmm......no.

dsvitak - you have emails and pms turned off so this is the only way to communicate with you. Get the suicide reference out of post 149 right now.

AnotherAlias · 10-23-2006, 07:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JDOldSchool

Your typing and spelling skills are tremendous for someone incapable of reading comprehension.

First of all, I didn't say he unknowingly cheated. I said he did something that happens to not be illegal, though he probably thought it was. More like he unknowingly didn't cheat on a loophole that is in the rulebook. It was posted here twice. You haven't read it either time.

Foreign substances, under that rule exception, are not all illegal. Please, try to understand that.

I believe you're giving Rogers more credit for being ignorant than he deserves. He's been in the league 17 years or so. If he doesn't realize what he was doing was illegal, he would have complained to the umpire and said, "It's just pine tar. I can use it on my hand, right?"

Instead, he washed his hand off.

He has done it before as the photos indicate, therefore I believe he knew exactly what he was doing.

andymac · 10-23-2006, 07:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dsvitak

Sure, this works...he is the ONLY PITCHER IN BASEBALL HISTORY TO BE AFFECTED IN THIS FASHION.

Ummmm......no.

You are being an idiot, you don't think that pitchers often have dirty hands?

Bay Area Bob · 10-23-2006, 07:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JDOldSchool

There is no way that was pine tar unless it transfered to the ball. There's just no way.

HOW CAN ANYONE ARGUE WITH THIS

dsvitak · 10-23-2006, 07:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bay Area Bob

WHY ARE YOU USING SARCASM TO FURTHER THE ARGUMENT OF YOUR OPPONENTS IN THIS HEATED DISCUSSION

This isn't the least bit heated.

Rogers cheated and got caught. All the evidence indicates he purposefully placed a foreign substance onto the heel of his pitching hand, like he has done on at least two other occasions this year.

I haven't furthered any arguments against this basic premise: Rogers cheated, and got caught.

What part of this are you not understanding?

I have heard NOTHING that would explain the repeated stains/marks/discolorations on his pitching hand, going back to at least July 20th.

Now, LaRussa is stating on local television that it was NOT dirt on his hand.

View Poll Results: Did Kenny Rogers Cheat During the Game Today?
Heck yeah! Nailed by the Camera!	25	28.41%
Insufficient Evidence to Convict...Probably Yes	34	38.64%
Dude, it was a GRASS STAIN!!! WOOT!!!!11!!!	20	22.73%
Llama Steaks are Quite Tasty!	9	10.23%
Voters: 88. You may not vote on this poll

10-23-2006, 07:03 PM	#166
CONN CHRIS Global Moderator Join Date: Oct 2004 Posts: 29,014	I understand that this is a heated discussion, but let's leave comments suggesting suicide and other personal attacks out of this. Bay area Bob self-edited his comment, dsvitak needs to do the same where he quoted the pre-edited post. And yes that means a warning may well be in the offing. __________________ Check Out My Cards!

10-23-2006, 07:00 PM	#162
Bay Area Bob Minors (Triple A) Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Alabama via Oregon via Alabama Posts: 14,268 Posts: 276	woohoo!!!!11 CAPS TO PROVE TEH ACCRSEE

10-23-2006, 07:01 PM	#163
magnet Hall Of Famer Join Date: Jun 2003 Posts: 5,029	What if it was fecal matter? Wouldn't you all feel like jackasses if Rogers has explosive diarrhea?

10-23-2006, 07:02 PM	#164
dsvitak Hall Of Famer Join Date: Dec 2002 Posts: 5,345	Breaking news, on the Fox 2 news affiliate in St. Louis. Tony LaRussa was just asked what was on Roger's hand, and he said, and I'll quote: "IT WASN'T DIRT."