Did Rogers Cheat - Page 4

phenom · 10-23-2006, 02:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cooleyvol

You're not being serious, right?

I mean...........come on.

What do you mean?

On June XX, 2006, Kenny Rogers faces the Chicago White Sox with a smudge on his hand. Umpire checks it out, sees nothing wrong with whatever's there, and it's not even worth the ink it'd use to print about it. So Kenny Rogers goes out on June XX+5, 2006, again with whatever's on his hand, and nobody says a word.

Now, I'm not saying that's exactly what happened, but really, it's possible.

Whatever was on his hand didn't just magically appear in the playoffs. I'm thinking it's entirely possible it's getting WAY overblown simply because of the size of the stage it's being played on.

AnotherAlias · 10-23-2006, 02:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by phenom

There's a joke to be made here, but I'm taking on the 3-0 count.

KurtBevacqua · 10-23-2006, 03:11 PM

http://mlb.mlb.com/NASApp/mlb/mlb/of.../pitcher_8.jsp

Quote:

8.02
The pitcher shall not --
(a) (1) Bring his pitching hand in contact with his mouth or lips while in the 18 foot circle surrounding the pitching rubber. EXCEPTION: Provided it is agreed to by both managers, the umpire prior to the start of a game played in cold weather, may permit the pitcher to blow on his hand. PENALTY: For violation of this part of this rule the umpires shall immediately call a ball. However, if the pitch is made and a batter reaches first base on a hit, an error, a hit batsman or otherwise, and no other runner is put out before advancing at least one base, the play shall proceed without reference to the violation. Repeated offenders shall be subject to a fine by the league president.
(2) expectorate on the ball, either hand or his glove;
(3) rub the ball on his glove, person or clothing;
(4) apply a foreign substance of any kind to the ball
(5) deface the ball in any manner; or
(6) deliver a ball defaced in a manner prescribed by Rule 8.02(a)(2) through (5) or what is called the “shine” ball, “spit” ball, “mud” ball or “emery” ball.The pitcher is allowed to rub the ball between his bare hands.

Whatever it is, it's on his pitching hand and coming into contact with the ball, and it appears to be on his hand quite often, more often than say an accidental smudge of dirt. And by the rules, even applying dirt to the ball is illegal. Whatever it is, perhaps umps in one game may consider it to be innocent or accidental. But having it on the hand game after game, in contact with the ball, whatever it is, seems to be a bit illegal.

And the rule very clearly refers to bare hands. Nothing bare about his hand in these pics.

phenom · 10-23-2006, 03:12 PM

Dirt's not a foreign substance. If it were, then they'd change the ball after every groundout, wouldn't you think?

KurtBevacqua · 10-23-2006, 03:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by phenom

Dirt's not a foreign substance. If it were, then they'd change the ball after every groundout, wouldn't you think?

The rule says a foreign substance of any kind. That seems pretty much all inclusive to me. Sweat, rosin, dirt, they all fall under that wording.

AnotherAlias · 10-23-2006, 03:16 PM

Reality is often difficult to deal with, yet as intelligent human beings we are faced with it everyday.

Goody · 10-23-2006, 03:16 PM

I wonder, are their any pictures from his perfect game in 1994? Will that achievement be tainted too?

Goody · 10-23-2006, 03:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by KurtBevacqua

The rule says a foreign substance of any kind. That seems pretty much all inclusive to me. Sweat, rosin, dirt, they all fall under that wording.

Dirt and rosin are not foreign. They are part of the playing field. The word foreign is used there for a reason...or they would simply have it say "ANY substance".

AnotherAlias · 10-23-2006, 03:20 PM

Doesn't appear to be dirt though.

And there are past photos of the same smudge. He just has dirt on his palm, in the same exact place everytime?

We're reaching here.

I understand. I had trouble dealing with Sammy Sosa's corked bat when he got busted. I didn't want to believe the truth either.

Bay Area Bob · 10-23-2006, 03:20 PM

teh ws suk roges chet

KurtBevacqua · 10-23-2006, 03:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 9lives

Dirt and rosin are not foreign. They are part of the playing field. The word foreign is used there for a reason...or they would simply have it say "ANY substance".

You can't put rosin on the ball. You can put it on your hand as long as you are off the mound, but you cannot apply it to the ball. Well known rule.

Goody · 10-23-2006, 03:21 PM

Think of the baseball field and the players on it as a country. If it comes from there, it is no foreign. "Mr. Pine tar" would be Canadian in this analogy...while "Sweat" is from Tuscaloosa, Alabama...."dirt" is from Long Beach, California, and "rosin", a Texan.

AnotherAlias · 10-23-2006, 03:22 PM

Isn't rosin white? The stuff on his palm should be white, if it were rosin.

imation · 10-23-2006, 03:22 PM

Why are we arguing over this? The people who believed he cheated are always going to believe it. The people who are believing what the umps said and what baseball officials said are never going to listen to the amateur hour detectives who believe he did cheat.

Goody · 10-23-2006, 03:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by imation

Why are we arguing over this? The people who believed he cheated are always going to believe it. The people who are believing what the umps said and what baseball officials said are never going to listen to the armature hour detectives who believe he did cheat.

*points to the title of this forum*

Goody · 10-23-2006, 03:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by AnotherAlias

Isn't rosin white? The stuff on his palm should be white, if it were rosin.

Not if its damp and mixed with dirt.

phenom · 10-23-2006, 03:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by imation

Why are we arguing over this? The people who believed he cheated are always going to believe it. The people who are believing what the umps said and what baseball officials said are never going to listen to the armature hour detectives who believe he did cheat.

Uhh, it's already been determined that it was pine tar.

RMPL, n00b!!!

AnotherAlias · 10-23-2006, 03:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by imation

Why are we arguing over this? The people who believed he cheated are always going to believe it. The people who are believing what the umps said and what baseball officials said are never going to listen to the amateur hour detectives who believe he did cheat.

Of course, the umps and baseball officials wouldn't be interested in preserving the integrity of the game by somehow ignoring this issue, would they?

AnotherAlias · 10-23-2006, 03:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 9lives

Not if its damp and mixed with dirt.

But, the stain was clearly visible after he washed it off. Pinetar would be more difficult to expunge with soap and water than plain dirt and rosin, wouldn't it?

imation · 10-23-2006, 03:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by AnotherAlias

Of course, the umps and baseball officials wouldn't be interested in preserving the integrity of the game by somehow ignoring this issue, would they?

Of course ESPN and Fox wouldn't want controversy. It would make people watch and ratings go up. Why would they want that?

View Poll Results: Did Kenny Rogers Cheat During the Game Today?
Heck yeah! Nailed by the Camera!	25	28.41%
Insufficient Evidence to Convict...Probably Yes	34	38.64%
Dude, it was a GRASS STAIN!!! WOOT!!!!11!!!	20	22.73%
Llama Steaks are Quite Tasty!	9	10.23%
Voters: 88. You may not vote on this poll

10-23-2006, 03:12 PM	#64
phenom Hall Of Famer Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: Near the Great Wall. On the GOOD side. Posts: 3,763	Dirt's not a foreign substance. If it were, then they'd change the ball after every groundout, wouldn't you think? __________________ reported

10-23-2006, 03:16 PM	#67
Goody Hall Of Famer Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: South Korea Posts: 3,530	I wonder, are their any pictures from his perfect game in 1994? Will that achievement be tainted too? __________________ In the past: Laseron Baseball Association creator. Present: I am Rezulm on PT and OOTP Discord. Future: I wish it was the past.

10-23-2006, 03:22 PM	#74
imation Major Leagues Join Date: Sep 2003 Posts: 307	Why are we arguing over this? The people who believed he cheated are always going to believe it. The people who are believing what the umps said and what baseball officials said are never going to listen to the amateur hour detectives who believe he did cheat. __________________ Last edited by imation; 10-23-2006 at 03:23 PM.

10-23-2006, 03:16 PM	#66
AnotherAlias Hall Of Famer Join Date: Aug 2002 Location: I'm back...for now Posts: 4,190	Reality is often difficult to deal with, yet as intelligent human beings we are faced with it everyday.

10-23-2006, 03:20 PM	#69
AnotherAlias Hall Of Famer Join Date: Aug 2002 Location: I'm back...for now Posts: 4,190	Doesn't appear to be dirt though. And there are past photos of the same smudge. He just has dirt on his palm, in the same exact place everytime? We're reaching here. I understand. I had trouble dealing with Sammy Sosa's corked bat when he got busted. I didn't want to believe the truth either.

10-23-2006, 03:20 PM	#70
Bay Area Bob Minors (Triple A) Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Alabama via Oregon via Alabama Posts: 14,268 Posts: 276	teh ws suk roges chet

10-23-2006, 03:21 PM	#72
Goody Hall Of Famer Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: South Korea Posts: 3,530	Think of the baseball field and the players on it as a country. If it comes from there, it is no foreign. "Mr. Pine tar" would be Canadian in this analogy...while "Sweat" is from Tuscaloosa, Alabama...."dirt" is from Long Beach, California, and "rosin", a Texan.