Foreign player limits

SC_Dawg · 07-07-2006, 06:35 PM

First off I am running with the 1.0.2 patch on a Pentium 4, 3.2 GHz, ATI Radeon X300 256MB Vid Card and plenty of HD space left available.

Now the one thing I was really hoping was corrected has been corrected half way as far as I can tell for now.

What I was hoping to find was that 0 foreign players would have been an option on the foreign players limit slection box. Instead we have No Limit and 1 through 10 players limit.

I know there is a foreigner percentage that is setable and that will enable me to not have any foreign players in the league at start-up but unfortunately this does not prevent a team from signing a foreign player from a nation that does not have an active league based in it.

For example

Let's assume I have a universe with all of the standard leagues in it at start-up and each of them have a foreigner percentage set to 0. Now if I do not permit trading between the various leagues and do not permit free agents from going from one major league to another this prevents players from other nations entering from other major leagues.

However what this does not prevent is a scout visiting a nation that does not have a major league in it and discovering a foreign national player that a team in one of the major leagues signs.

The foreigner percentage is only the initial percentage of foreign born players in the league. Once the universe starts the foreign player limit overrides this percentage and since the smallest amount we can now have is 1 player.

To test this I started a universe with the attached settings. Then I simmed up to opening day and you will see where there are 7 Mexican players in the league.

What I would like to be able to do is to limit the number of foreign players to 0 in the league at the start of the universe then over time increase the number of foreign players slowly. I believe that if the Foreign Players Limit had 0 as a possible selection this would accomplish this.

SC_Dawg · 07-08-2006, 08:52 AM

Just a gentle bump to hopefully get somebody to acknowledge this either as a bug and give it a TT # or formally say it is an enahncement and will not be addressed in 2006.

Though I don't think making 0 a selectable number in the Foreign player limit would be that difficult.

SC_Dawg · 07-09-2006, 02:06 AM

Bumping back to page 1

Raidergoo · 07-09-2006, 02:29 AM

I 'll look at this when I can stay awake . . .

endgame · 07-09-2006, 03:06 AM

So you're attempting to keep the entire league foreign-free, even with signings? I don't think the 0 has anything to do with that, really. All the foreign player limit parameters do is determine how many slots are available in active rosters. So even if you have 0 active roster slots available, that's not going to keep an ambitious Venezuelan from signing on to play in your AAA league or develop on your reserve. I'm not sure if ammy-creation is also affected by foreign player percentage, but I think it is.

SC_Dawg · 07-09-2006, 10:06 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by endgame

So you're attempting to keep the entire league foreign-free, even with signings? I don't think the 0 has anything to do with that, really. All the foreign player limit parameters do is determine how many slots are available in active rosters. So even if you have 0 active roster slots available, that's not going to keep an ambitious Venezuelan from signing on to play in your AAA league or develop on your reserve. I'm not sure if ammy-creation is also affected by foreign player percentage, but I think it is.

Not to be disagreeable but according to the game itself, the rules tab on the minor leagues states the Roster and Financial Rules from the Parent League Apply.

Raidergoo · 07-09-2006, 12:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SC_Dawg

What I would like to be able to do is to limit the number of foreign players to 0 in the league at the start of the universe then over time increase the number of foreign players slowly. I believe that if the Foreign Players Limit had 0 as a possible selection this would accomplish this.

Would you say that this is the key takeaway on this topic? I think I can make a feature request on this item if it is.

SC_Dawg · 07-09-2006, 01:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Raidergoo

Quote:

Originally Posted by SC_Dawg

What I would like to be able to do is to limit the number of foreign players to 0 in the league at the start of the universe then over time increase the number of foreign players slowly. I believe that if the Foreign Players Limit had 0 as a possible selection this would accomplish this.

Would you say that this is the key takeaway on this topic? I think I can make a feature request on this item if it is.

Yes, although I am going to put one caveat in the statement.

I am going on the assumption that the minor league rules page is accurate when it states the affiliated minor league will use the same roster and financial rules as it's parent major league.

Just to further expand what I was looking to do originally that just doesn't quite work.

I am working on a universe that I would like to do the following

SCML a US based 16 team fictional league
SCML AAA
SCML AA
SCML A
SCML Short Season A
SCML Rookie A
[league redacted] League
Nippon Baseball Ni-Gun League
Korean Baseball Organization
Taiwan Professional Baseball League
Cuban Baseball League (With a changed reality of no Castro so players are free to leave)
Mexican League
Dominican Winter League
Mexican Winter League
Puerto Rican Winter League
Venezuelan Winter League

When the SCML begins in 1931 it will contain only players that are native born United States citizens. After WW II the league will begin to admit foreign born players with the restriction of 1 foreign national per team. This roster limit will change to 2 foreign nationals per team in 1961, four in 1976, 8 in 1991 and finally beginning in 2006 there will be no limit to the number of foreign nationals. Other foreign leagues will have similar setups for foreign players allowed.

I know if I leave all of the player trade and free agent movement between leagues on the best I can get to start is 1 foreign player per team the way the game works now.

I know this is probably more than you were looking for in an answer

SC_Dawg · 07-10-2006, 07:49 AM

Bump back to page 1.

Raidergoo · 07-10-2006, 02:26 PM

Note to self to look at after work.

Raidergoo · 07-10-2006, 09:51 PM

I admit I had to reread this request about 4 times before I understood what you are wanting and why, and after much thought, it made sense to me.

I have made a feature request for this item. It is TT # 2147. It would not surprise me if this got flagged for a future version, but it is in the system now for Markus to evaluate.

SC_Dawg · 07-10-2006, 10:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Raidergoo

I admit I had to reread this request about 4 times before I understood what you are wanting and why, and after much thought, it made sense to me.

I have made a feature request for this item. It is TT # 2147. It would not surprise me if this got flagged for a future version, but it is in the system now for Markus to evaluate.

Well that was 3 times less than it took me to write it in a readable fashion.

Anyhow to be honest I don't think this should be a horrendously difficult task to accomplish but if Markus decides to delay it until 2007 I can understand, not like but will understand, it.

Raidergoo · 07-11-2006, 12:16 AM

You never know with programming. It could be a 5 second fix, or impossible without major plumbing work.

I gave it the best I could do.

Raidergoo · 07-19-2006, 12:23 PM

This is now set to a rare catagory

Add to next full release

Most of the long term feature requests I make get set to consider for next full release. I've never had one set to Add.

I understand it that you will get what you want; unfortunately just not right away.

SC_Dawg · 07-19-2006, 06:09 PM

That is all I can say

Carplos · 07-20-2006, 03:59 AM

Quote:

Once the universe starts the foreign player limit overrides this percentage and since the smallest amount we can now have is 1 player.

Actually you can't even set it to 1. The overall foreign player limit is just used to give the individual pitcher/pos. player boxes numbers to work with. But if you set one of those to 1, the only option for the other is no limit... which means teams could have only 1 of either a pitcher or pos. player depending on what you set... but unlimited for the other.

It also means you can't set a foreign player limit and let teams use the spots as they wish. For two players, it can only be one pitcher/one player, for three it needs to be 2 of one and 1 of the other. Two and two, or three and one for four, etc.

Honestly, this bugs me a whole lot more than most of the AI issues.

Oh well.

The only workaround I've thought of but haven't really tried: Set the foreign player to % so no foreign players are generated for the draft (or initial creation), and restrict free agents being signed from other leagues.

The two major drawbacks are:

A) If you have more than one league in the nation, it doesn't allow teams to sign players from other leagues within in the nation either.

B) If you allow players to leave the league, nationals won't be able to come back unless you manually move all nationals from other leagues back to the domestic league free agent pool when they become FAs, get released, etc (which would still allow them to sign with other leagues as well.)

Carplos · 07-20-2006, 04:48 AM

Also forgot to mention: No matter what your foreign player limit settings are, the minors have unlimited, so even if they were to add a 0 option in a patch, you'd still have to use a workaround to prevent foreign players from entering the league at all, even though it'd make absolutely no sense for a team to sign foreigners for their minors with such a rule (especially with no naturalization process in the game...)

I know what screen says about following the rules of the major league, but the Game Guide says the above.

SC_Dawg · 07-20-2006, 10:23 PM

Yup you are correct definately not working anywhere near as advertised in the game. It really really depressing to know my dream universe cannot be created due to this single limitation.

Actually I do not understand, I thought I did but now it is obvious I don't, the whole Foreign Players limit when it is wholly dependent upon the individual Foreign Hitter Limit and Foreign Pitcher Limit. Right now if you have them set to 1 each, which is the lowest you can set them, the actual Foreign Player limit at the ML level is 2 regardless of what you use in the Foreign Player Limit.

The minor league rules are broken I agree. I have my test league set to 1 Foreign Player with 1 Hitter and 1 Pitcher at the ML level and in the minor leagues I am seeing teams breaking the Pitcher limit, Hitter limit and total players limit. In the ML I am seeing teams following the Hitter and Pitcher limits but the Player limit of 1 can and is exceeded.

SC_Dawg · 08-07-2006, 05:53 PM

I have found a work around for my original plan. If you do not want to have foreigners in the initial league setup you can just set the ability to trade, sign free agents from other major leagues or have players leave for other major leagues set to no. This will eliminate the problem of having the foreigners in the starting league.

The during future preseason's you can turn these switches back on and set the number of foreigners on the ML rosters as you want (sort of).

The minor leagues will still have the problem of too many foreign players once you legalize foreigners in the league but I can live with that.

Not the perfect solution but better than I had originally. Now I can go ahead with my initial plan.

07-07-2006, 06:35 PM	#1
SC_Dawg All Star Reserve Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Columbia, South Carolina Posts: 664	Foreign player limits First off I am running with the 1.0.2 patch on a Pentium 4, 3.2 GHz, ATI Radeon X300 256MB Vid Card and plenty of HD space left available. Now the one thing I was really hoping was corrected has been corrected half way as far as I can tell for now. What I was hoping to find was that 0 foreign players would have been an option on the foreign players limit slection box. Instead we have No Limit and 1 through 10 players limit. I know there is a foreigner percentage that is setable and that will enable me to not have any foreign players in the league at start-up but unfortunately this does not prevent a team from signing a foreign player from a nation that does not have an active league based in it. For example Let's assume I have a universe with all of the standard leagues in it at start-up and each of them have a foreigner percentage set to 0. Now if I do not permit trading between the various leagues and do not permit free agents from going from one major league to another this prevents players from other nations entering from other major leagues. However what this does not prevent is a scout visiting a nation that does not have a major league in it and discovering a foreign national player that a team in one of the major leagues signs. The foreigner percentage is only the initial percentage of foreign born players in the league. Once the universe starts the foreign player limit overrides this percentage and since the smallest amount we can now have is 1 player. To test this I started a universe with the attached settings. Then I simmed up to opening day and you will see where there are 7 Mexican players in the league. What I would like to be able to do is to limit the number of foreign players to 0 in the league at the start of the universe then over time increase the number of foreign players slowly. I believe that if the Foreign Players Limit had 0 as a possible selection this would accomplish this. Attached Images

07-09-2006, 03:06 AM	#5
endgame Hall Of Famer Join Date: Aug 2002 Posts: 16,842	So you're attempting to keep the entire league foreign-free, even with signings? I don't think the 0 has anything to do with that, really. All the foreign player limit parameters do is determine how many slots are available in active rosters. So even if you have 0 active roster slots available, that's not going to keep an ambitious Venezuelan from signing on to play in your AAA league or develop on your reserve. I'm not sure if ammy-creation is also affected by foreign player percentage, but I think it is. __________________ "Try again. Fail again. Fail better." -- Samuel Beckett _____________________________________________

08-07-2006, 05:53 PM	#19
SC_Dawg All Star Reserve Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Columbia, South Carolina Posts: 664	Udate I have found a work around for my original plan. If you do not want to have foreigners in the initial league setup you can just set the ability to trade, sign free agents from other major leagues or have players leave for other major leagues set to no. This will eliminate the problem of having the foreigners in the starting league. The during future preseason's you can turn these switches back on and set the number of foreigners on the ML rosters as you want (sort of). The minor leagues will still have the problem of too many foreign players once you legalize foreigners in the league but I can live with that. Not the perfect solution but better than I had originally. Now I can go ahead with my initial plan.

07-08-2006, 08:52 AM	#2
SC_Dawg All Star Reserve Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Columbia, South Carolina Posts: 664	Just a gentle bump to hopefully get somebody to acknowledge this either as a bug and give it a TT # or formally say it is an enahncement and will not be addressed in 2006. Though I don't think making 0 a selectable number in the Foreign player limit would be that difficult.

07-09-2006, 02:06 AM	#3
SC_Dawg All Star Reserve Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Columbia, South Carolina Posts: 664	Bumping back to page 1

07-09-2006, 02:29 AM	#4
Raidergoo Hall Of Famer Join Date: Mar 2003 Posts: 9,005	I 'll look at this when I can stay awake . . .

07-10-2006, 07:49 AM	#9
SC_Dawg All Star Reserve Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Columbia, South Carolina Posts: 664	Bump back to page 1.

07-10-2006, 02:26 PM	#10
Raidergoo Hall Of Famer Join Date: Mar 2003 Posts: 9,005	Note to self to look at after work.

07-10-2006, 09:51 PM	#11
Raidergoo Hall Of Famer Join Date: Mar 2003 Posts: 9,005	I admit I had to reread this request about 4 times before I understood what you are wanting and why, and after much thought, it made sense to me. I have made a feature request for this item. It is TT # 2147. It would not surprise me if this got flagged for a future version, but it is in the system now for Markus to evaluate.

07-11-2006, 12:16 AM	#13
Raidergoo Hall Of Famer Join Date: Mar 2003 Posts: 9,005	You never know with programming. It could be a 5 second fix, or impossible without major plumbing work. I gave it the best I could do.

07-19-2006, 12:23 PM	#14
Raidergoo Hall Of Famer Join Date: Mar 2003 Posts: 9,005	This is now set to a rare catagory *Add to next full release* Most of the long term feature requests I make get set to consider for next full release. I've never had one set to Add. I understand it that you will get what you want; unfortunately just not right away.

07-19-2006, 06:09 PM	#15
SC_Dawg All Star Reserve Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Columbia, South Carolina Posts: 664	That is all I can say

07-20-2006, 04:48 AM	#17
Carplos Hall Of Famer Join Date: Feb 2002 Location: Idaho Posts: 2,846 Infractions: 1/0 (0)	Also forgot to mention: No matter what your foreign player limit settings are, the minors have unlimited, so even if they were to add a 0 option in a patch, you'd still have to use a workaround to prevent foreign players from entering the league at all, even though it'd make absolutely no sense for a team to sign foreigners for their minors with such a rule (especially with no naturalization process in the game...) I know what screen says about following the rules of the major league, but the Game Guide says the above.

07-20-2006, 10:23 PM	#18
SC_Dawg All Star Reserve Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Columbia, South Carolina Posts: 664	Yup you are correct definately not working anywhere near as advertised in the game. It really really depressing to know my dream universe cannot be created due to this single limitation. Actually I do not understand, I thought I did but now it is obvious I don't, the whole Foreign Players limit when it is wholly dependent upon the individual Foreign Hitter Limit and Foreign Pitcher Limit. Right now if you have them set to 1 each, which is the lowest you can set them, the actual Foreign Player limit at the ML level is 2 regardless of what you use in the Foreign Player Limit. The minor league rules are broken I agree. I have my test league set to 1 Foreign Player with 1 Hitter and 1 Pitcher at the ML level and in the minor leagues I am seeing teams breaking the Pitcher limit, Hitter limit and total players limit. In the ML I am seeing teams following the Hitter and Pitcher limits but the Player limit of 1 can and is exceeded.