league evo - less/more pitching and offense

NoOne · 04-01-2016, 12:41 AM

only in regard to less/more pitching or more/less offense.

does anyone have info, backed by numbers, about how much it can sway things? how often? etc etc..

maybe info on each option alone and when used together would be awesome

my league's long-term average as a point of reference:
.2555BA / .319-.320obp / .399

i don't need a statistical rundown.. just some concpets ... like "if you typically have a .255, you'll see it dip as low as .xxx" (or a max increase, i bet it's even each way)

i see .250 - .260 without league evo on. i'd like to see .245-.265. with the extremes being a culmination of draft quality of recent years. so, it should stick around a few years before magically jumping from .245 to .258 or something in one year.

i'd defintely like a little more fluctuation than the +/- .006 BA i currently see (such a small range is quite disturbing). but, i don't want it dipping into the low .240s or something for decades.

also, does it change LTMs or does it manipulate PCMs? this is key for me. talent driving change is good, but a dial changing results with no tangible reason within the game is not good. i'd rather my world maintain its physics (changing ltm without reason is like changing gravity).

andrewv500 · 04-01-2016, 07:07 PM

First, sorry, but I don't have any hard numbers for you. But for many iterations of this game more/less offense/pitching was the only league evolution option I would enable and in my experience there were noticeable changes or fluctuations over many years, much more than what I would see without them enabled.

As to the LTM's and PCM's etc it does not change those in any way.

With all that said I did not use it last version and have not had enough time with this version yet, so hopefully someone else can be of better assistance

NoOne · 04-02-2016, 03:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by andrewv500

First, sorry, but I don't have any hard numbers for you. But for many iterations of this game more/less offense/pitching was the only league evolution option I would enable and in my experience there were noticeable changes or fluctuations over many years, much more than what I would see without them enabled.

As to the LTM's and PCM's etc it does not change those in any way.

With all that said I did not use it last version and have not had enough time with this version yet, so hopefully someone else can be of better assistance

would you see it could drop BA by more than .015? best guess.

i used the 'hard number' line to scare off non-educated guesses, lol. you have experience, so i'd love to know max effect on BA and ERA that you've seen.

i may end up using just one. i'd like to see it fluctuate a bit more, but not too drastically.

e.g. a .240 league for a decade would suck from my point of view. but, so would a .270 league for 10 years.

thanks for the reply

Eiskrap · 04-02-2016, 05:18 PM

I ran an MLB Quick Start test sim to 2085 with both More and Less Offense and Pitching selected. I've then plotted the league ERA below compared to the just a default Quick Start with no changes. On the graphs the green line shows actual for the last few years and in 2016 the black line is all OOTP.

There doesn't seem to be any difference in the volatility, I was hoping to see peaks and troughs of around 10 years where ERA grew/declined.

When I get around to it, I'll replicate with just More Offense and see if that changes anything...

Ron. · 04-02-2016, 05:27 PM

Quote:

There doesn't seem to be any difference in the volatility

I think the more/less settings refer to specific events (e.g. mound being lowered) that affect offense & pitching, and are rare even with those options on. If you didn't happen to get those events then you wouldn't see a difference.

I had a 50 or 60 year sim in 16 and only had one such event. It looks like I've deleted the save but as I recall it changed the runs scored by a few %.

Eiskrap · 04-02-2016, 05:38 PM

Really? I had assumed it just meant general changes in league performance as the league evolves. If it relates to a specific event that doesn't happen in a 70 year sim, I think I'll just leave it off.

Ron. · 04-02-2016, 05:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Eiskrap

Really? I had assumed it just meant general changes in league performance as the league evolves.

Yeh, I think so. The mound lowering event I got was barely noticeable above the normal variation you get just from talent shifts.

I'd like to see more offense/pitching evolution too... I guess you could always do it manually with the modifiers, maybe roll dice to determine which way your league is shifting.

pgjocki · 04-02-2016, 06:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Eiskrap

I ran an MLB Quick Start test sim to 2085 with both More and Less Offense and Pitching selected. I've then plotted the league ERA below compared to the just a default Quick Start with no changes. On the graphs the green line shows actual for the last few years and in 2016 the black line is all OOTP.

There doesn't seem to be any difference in the volatility, I was hoping to see peaks and troughs of around 10 years where ERA grew/declined.

When I get around to it, I'll replicate with just More Offense and see if that changes anything...

No significant peaks but this shows how stable the sim engine is over time.

Now, can you do this several now times and compare those results against each other?

NoOne · 04-06-2016, 01:14 AM

Yeah, i think picking one or the other would be best. even though the storyline is "raising/lowering the mound" the game has to account for this somehwere. if it's not visibly changing LTM/PCM, it could easily do this under the hood. since raising the mound sounds more like an ltm change, i'd definitely try more/less offense by itself. once i get my LTM as i want them, i will do the same.

Well, here is a quasi-baseline of standard settings. even 107 might be light on years for this. i used static LTMs, no evolution and pre-simmed 30 years before collecting data. fictional from the start. pcm for hitting 1.050 and pcm for avoid K's .950. Less power in my league compared to default, see Slug average. ai eval 40 ratings & 36/18/6 stats. the rest is default for the most part. will frame this relative to offense even though there are two competing forces.

in 100 years, i see 2 distinct eras. 10+ years at end of above average offense, then ~20 years in the middle of consistent below average offense.

it's a .2546/.3188/.3986 107-yr Slash League.

AVG/OBP/Slug and ERA EDIT: crap... i'll redo obp as a % BB or BB/9 later. obp doesn't help much really

04-01-2016, 12:41 AM	#1
NoOne Hall Of Famer Join Date: Apr 2015 Posts: 7,228	league evo - less/more pitching and offense only in regard to less/more pitching or more/less offense. does anyone have info, backed by numbers, about how much it can sway things? how often? etc etc.. maybe info on each option alone and when used together would be awesome my league's long-term average as a point of reference: .2555BA / .319-.320obp / .399 i don't need a statistical rundown.. just some concpets ... like "if you typically have a .255, you'll see it dip as low as .xxx" (or a max increase, i bet it's even each way) i see .250 - .260 without league evo on. i'd like to see .245-.265. with the extremes being a culmination of draft quality of recent years. so, it should stick around a few years before magically jumping from .245 to .258 or something in one year. i'd defintely like a little more fluctuation than the +/- .006 BA i currently see (such a small range is quite disturbing). but, i don't want it dipping into the low .240s or something for decades. also, does it change LTMs or does it manipulate PCMs? this is key for me. talent driving change is good, but a dial changing results with no tangible reason within the game is not good. i'd rather my world maintain its physics (changing ltm without reason is like changing gravity).

04-02-2016, 05:18 PM	#4
Eiskrap Minors (Rookie Ball) Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: London, England Posts: 29	I ran an MLB Quick Start test sim to 2085 with both More and Less Offense and Pitching selected. I've then plotted the league ERA below compared to the just a default Quick Start with no changes. On the graphs the green line shows actual for the last few years and in 2016 the black line is all OOTP. There doesn't seem to be any difference in the volatility, I was hoping to see peaks and troughs of around 10 years where ERA grew/declined. When I get around to it, I'll replicate with just More Offense and see if that changes anything... Attached Images Last edited by Eiskrap; 04-02-2016 at 05:24 PM.

04-06-2016, 01:14 AM	#9
NoOne Hall Of Famer Join Date: Apr 2015 Posts: 7,228	Yeah, i think picking one or the other would be best. even though the storyline is "raising/lowering the mound" the game has to account for this somehwere. if it's not visibly changing LTM/PCM, it could easily do this under the hood. since raising the mound sounds more like an ltm change, i'd definitely try more/less offense by itself. once i get my LTM as i want them, i will do the same. Well, here is a quasi-baseline of standard settings. even 107 might be light on years for this. i used static LTMs, no evolution and pre-simmed 30 years before collecting data. fictional from the start. pcm for hitting 1.050 and pcm for avoid K's .950. Less power in my league compared to default, see Slug average. ai eval 40 ratings & 36/18/6 stats. the rest is default for the most part. will frame this relative to offense even though there are two competing forces. in 100 years, i see 2 distinct eras. 10+ years at end of above average offense, then ~20 years in the middle of consistent below average offense. it's a .2546/.3188/.3986 107-yr Slash League. AVG/OBP/Slug and ERA EDIT: crap... i'll redo obp as a % BB or BB/9 later. obp doesn't help much really Attached Images Last edited by NoOne; 04-06-2016 at 03:10 AM.

04-01-2016, 07:07 PM	#2
andrewv500 Minors (Rookie Ball) Join Date: Oct 2013 Posts: 33	First, sorry, but I don't have any hard numbers for you. But for many iterations of this game more/less offense/pitching was the only league evolution option I would enable and in my experience there were noticeable changes or fluctuations over many years, much more than what I would see without them enabled. As to the LTM's and PCM's etc it does not change those in any way. With all that said I did not use it last version and have not had enough time with this version yet, so hopefully someone else can be of better assistance

04-02-2016, 05:38 PM	#6
Eiskrap Minors (Rookie Ball) Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: London, England Posts: 29	Really? I had assumed it just meant general changes in league performance as the league evolves. If it relates to a specific event that doesn't happen in a 70 year sim, I think I'll just leave it off.