Can we remove the pitcher's stamina level in 3D

[hfield007]

Like many I like to play my games out 1 by 1.

One of the things when doing this that I don't relaly like is a visual on the pitcher's exhaustion level with a meter. It doesn't feel realistic.

Is there a way we can make that optional?? So that as the manager I can judge whether to go to the bullpen by how many pitches my pitcher has thrown and how hes doing? It would feel more immersive if I was making these decisions based on pitch count and ability rather than a big color coded meter.

[BusterKing]

optional to turn it off, remains on by default. I like it the way it is.

[Sweed]

With regard to realism I would argue...

If I'm managing a real game I would have visual clues on how my P was doing.
Mechanics starting to breakdown with fatigue, P's demeanor, etc.

In OOTP? I don't get those visual clues. I have pitch count and velocity (I think may dip on fastballs as fatigue sets in?). I think the meter represents the visual clues, I would have IRL, that I can't get in OOTP.

But yeah, if they can make that as an option (on by default) I wouldn't argue against it.

[jmolony3]

Originally Posted by Sweed

With regard to realism I would argue...

If I'm managing a real game I would have visual clues on how my P was doing.
Mechanics starting to breakdown with fatigue, P's demeanor, etc.

In OOTP? I don't get those visual clues. I have pitch count and velocity (I think may dip on fastballs as fatigue sets in?). I think the meter represents the visual clues, I would have IRL, that I can't get in OOTP.

But yeah, if they can make that as an option (on by default) I wouldn't argue against it.

I agree, compare the performance I am seeing with the gauge and the upcoming batters when deciding to pull a pitcher.

[Syd Thrift]

I play out the games and frankly I like having the stamina bar in there. At the very least I think it ought to be optional. Sometimes, especially in historical saves, it's not as easy as just looking at the pitch count to determine if a guy is gassed or not, and IRL you get more endpoints than "has the thrown a lot of pitches" and "did he just give up like 6 straight long hits".

[hfield007]

Originally Posted by Syd Thrift

I play out the games and frankly I like having the stamina bar in there. At the very least I think it ought to be optional. Sometimes, especially in historical saves, it's not as easy as just looking at the pitch count to determine if a guy is gassed or not, and IRL you get more endpoints than "has the thrown a lot of pitches" and "did he just give up like 6 straight long hits".

definitely dont think it should be thrown out altogether but would love it to just be optional. if im playing a long time sim i have an idea of what is a high pitch count based on the era modifiers i have.

[SkipBranham]

Originally Posted by Sweed

With regard to realism I would argue...

If I'm managing a real game I would have visual clues on how my P was doing.
Mechanics starting to breakdown with fatigue, P's demeanor, etc.

In OOTP? I don't get those visual clues. I have pitch count and velocity (I think may dip on fastballs as fatigue sets in?). I think the meter represents the visual clues, I would have IRL, that I can't get in OOTP.

But yeah, if they can make that as an option (on by default) I wouldn't argue against it.

Totally agree with you on this one. With the lack of visual clues it's hard to read what is going on up on the mound.

Something I haven't really paid attention to is pitch velocity in later innings. Does starting pitchers velocity dip as they fatigue later in games?

[CBLCardinals]

Agreed - would love to see this as optional to turn off.

[hfield007]

Originally Posted by Sweed

With regard to realism I would argue...

If I'm managing a real game I would have visual clues on how my P was doing.
Mechanics starting to breakdown with fatigue, P's demeanor, etc.

In OOTP? I don't get those visual clues. I have pitch count and velocity (I think may dip on fastballs as fatigue sets in?). I think the meter represents the visual clues, I would have IRL, that I can't get in OOTP.

But yeah, if they can make that as an option (on by default) I wouldn't argue against it.

I like the argument of we cant actually see differences of what the pitcher is doing.

But instead of a meter it would be cool if our pitching coach popped up with a notification or our catcher "he's looking gassed on the mound, boss" or something generic haha. Small tells they can give you that maybe it is based on the skill of my pitching coach how good the info he gives me is and I can mix that with my ideas based on his pitch count and performance.

I just want an option of any kind to move away from the meter which feels too video game.

[BarneyRubble]

An option to turn it off would be a good thing.

[PSUColonel]

I like the idea of having communication with your pitching coach as opposed to the meter….obviously mound visits should also be of help.

[BarneyRubble]

I'll take it a step further. I'd like to see an additional (optional) widget geared more towards a GM (spectator). A widget with NO ratings, none, zero. I'd like more immersion. I watch every game with no keyboard input. I'd like to see personal information, like age, hometown, draft round, bats (could be a switch hitter), throws, height, etc... Immersion would much improved. Season, last year and career stats are great, especially if steals, doubles, and saves were included.

Rant follows concerning the current batter widget...

The stats at the bottom of the current batter widget display 'AVG', 'OBP' and 'SLG', no complaints. However, the top displays 'AVG', 'OBP' and 'OPS'. You've given me 'OBP', so I must ask why would I care about 'OPS'? Please show 'SLG' at the top, just like the bottom. I want stats, not a mathematical problem.

OBP tells me how often a player gets on base per PA (BB included). SLG tells me the average 'number of bases' a batter gets per AB (BB disregarded). What does OPS tell me? Well, OPS tells me what number I get when I add OBP and SLG. Two hitters with an 800 OPS can be vastly different. 300/500 and 420/380 can't even be compared.

[Bunktown Ballers]

Originally Posted by hfield007

Like many I like to play my games out 1 by 1.

One of the things when doing this that I don't relaly like is a visual on the pitcher's exhaustion level with a meter. It doesn't feel realistic.

Is there a way we can make that optional?? So that as the manager I can judge whether to go to the bullpen by how many pitches my pitcher has thrown and how hes doing? It would feel more immersive if I was making these decisions based on pitch count and ability rather than a big color coded meter.

Nearly every pitching decision in MLB is based on pitch count. If my pitcher is getting batters out and his stamina says he's used up....I tend to go on a bit more..I know I'm risking injury

[hfield007]

Originally Posted by PSUColonel

I like the idea of having communication with your pitching coach as opposed to the meter….obviously mound visits should also be of help.

maybe i am wrong, but mound visits seem like there is nothing to them outside of giving your pen time. cant remember if they do anything under the hood but as far as on the surface if his meter is tanked he tells ya he had enough and if it isnt he says hes good lol.

I'd really love anything that takes the meter away though. a pitch coach integration would be ideal with his ratings impacting the quality of info you get.

[hfield007]

Originally Posted by Bunktown Ballers

Nearly every pitching decision in MLB is based on pitch count. If my pitcher is getting batters out and his stamina says he's used up....I tend to go on a bit more..I know I'm risking injury

thats why i would like it to be optional. knowing he has an "X" stamina is one thing, but i would like to think that gives me a barometer of how many pitches i should run with him rather than a very black and white (or red and green lol) meter that definitively tells me how much he has left. just feels very inauthentic to the immersion sometimes.

[Ataraxzy]

Piggybacking on this thread, does anyone know what the effects of that bar going down are?

[Bluenoser]

Can live with or without the fatigue bar, pitch count absolutely MUST stay.

[Syd Thrift]

Originally Posted by PSUColonel

I like the idea of having communication with your pitching coach as opposed to the meter….obviously mound visits should also be of help.

To me the meter is a stand-in for a lot of things that a manager would be able to see / understand themselves, including the pitcher’s body language, changes in mechanics, a direct idea of where pitches are missing in the zone if they are (like, a sinker/slider guy missing high is a bad sign but a 4 seam pitcher missing high might not be), lower velocity, and yes, eventually talking to the catcher and pitcher on the mound although you only get one visit per inning so you’d better make that count.

When the game includes all of the above, sure, perhaps a bar delineating fatigue won’t be as needful.

[Ataraxzy]

Originally Posted by Syd Thrift

To me the meter is a stand-in for a lot of things that a manager would be able to see / understand themselves, including the pitcher’s body language, changes in mechanics, a direct idea of where pitches are missing in the zone if they are (like, a sinker/slider guy missing high is a bad sign but a 4 seam pitcher missing high might not be), lower velocity, and yes, eventually talking to the catcher and pitcher on the mound although you only get one visit per inning so you’d better make that count.

When the game includes all of the above, sure, perhaps a bar delineating fatigue won’t be as needful.

Exactly this. It's a stand-in, and a necessary one for those that watch/manage games. If you're just simming stuff, the sim engine takes care of that by being results-based, but if you can interact with the game as it's being played, and IRL has cues that you don't have access to, you need something.

[Sweed]

Originally Posted by hfield007

I like the argument of we cant actually see differences of what the pitcher is doing.

But instead of a meter it would be cool if our pitching coach popped up with a notification or our catcher "he's looking gassed on the mound, boss" or something generic haha. Small tells they can give you that maybe it is based on the skill of my pitching coach how good the info he gives me is and I can mix that with my ideas based on his pitch count and performance.

I just want an option of any kind to move away from the meter which feels too video game.

So you want the same information just delivered to you in a different manner? Fair enough I guess but.. "no meter" sounds more gamey to me than having one. Let me explain..

Only your pitching coach or catcher keeps you updated? How real is that? You're saying, other than pitch count, you would be unaware until the P-coach or C told you this guy is starting to tank? Doesn't seem realistic to me.

As a manager you do have your own set of eyes and experience in professional baseball. I think you should be able to see most of this stuff for yourself. Which of course.. takes us back to the meter.

Too me the meter is the most efficient way of giving us the ability to "see" our pitcher. I've never thought of it as "gamey". I have always thought it works well together with pitch count to do exactly what it is intended to do. IE let me "see" my P. IOW I shouldn't have to go looking (ask the PC or C) for information that would be right in front of my eyes IRL. A deeper mound visit model where the P and C have an opinion (not the generic stuff you see now) that I can weigh in with what I am seeing? That would be cool. To have to rely on their opinion rather than the bar? Not something I find realistic, as already noted.


Options are fine as long as the current model remains. my 2 cents