Converting a catcher to leftfield

bulldog55 · 02-25-2005, 02:40 AM

I am looking at going into my next season with two outfielders, if I can move one that I've had on the block for a while.

Trading him would be contingent on being able to find a replacement, and I doubt that could come through free agency as our payroll is through the roof.

The thing is, I have two excellent catchers. The better of the two offensively is horrible on defense, and I think the team would be better served if he wasn't catching where we could utilise his bat more. So I got to thinking about teaching him leftfield next Spring.

Has anyone tried teaching a catcher leftfield? Paul LoDuca and Jason Kendall can play the outfield. I can't imagine it's impossible. What do you think the likelihood is of a 23-year-old catcher learning to play left in one Spring?

TheRockCT · 02-25-2005, 03:04 AM

Well, I've had success with it a couple of times. I have more success with C's turning into 1B, but I've also seen a few end up in the OF. It varies for timeframe though, I had one learn it in 2-3 weeks, and another learn it about 3/4th of the way through the season. Since I assume you're going to teach him in the majors and not via ST, your defense in LF will be pitiful until he does learn it, and even then he's a bad catcher defensively, so he'll probably be pretty bad in the OF, too.

bulldog55 · 02-25-2005, 03:06 AM

I was planning on teaching him in ST. He's fully developed already offensively. Can he take talent hits?

TheRockCT · 02-25-2005, 03:11 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bulldog55

I was planning on teaching him in ST. He's fully developed already offensively. Can he take talent hits?

Talent-wise, not likely. But depending on where you take the points from offensively, his actual "rating points" will almost always suffer. Usually if I see guys learn the position, but let's say (out of a 1-100 scale) he has a 73 overall eye rating and a 73 overall eye talent. If you took all his points away from Eye, his actual Eye rating might drop to the low/mid 60's or something.

So he'll have to develop back up to a 73 talent in Eye again, barring no other talent hits/increases, etc. Sometimes it can be better than that, sometimes it can be a lot worse than that. But there are often times you'll find that note that says he can't adjust to the position, AND he takes losses in defense or whatever offensive rating you took the points from. So it's dangerous, that's why I try to teach guys as many positions as I can get away with while they're in the minors, because there are fewer repercussions.

ctorg · 02-25-2005, 08:34 AM

Yes, actually. I had a similar situation to yours. I had a great defensive catcher who was a pretty decent hitter (High OBP, no power) and an All-Star catcher with zero defensive skills. I undertook a big project. First, I converted the bad fielding catcher to LF. It worked, but he was really bad. Over the next few years, I gave him defensive points in spring training. He gradually improved until, about 4 or 5 years later, he was actually an average fielder in left. He was really young when I started his conversion (something like 23 or 24), so I'm sure that helped.

Bald Eagles · 02-25-2005, 09:25 AM

If you manually assign this catcher to start everyday in left, he will, at some point, earn a defensive rating in left. As Rock said, you'll have limited defense in left until he officially learns it.

Malleus Dei · 02-25-2005, 09:40 AM

Why turn him into an LF instead of a 1B? Is it because you have a gaping hole in LF, or perhaps you already have a stud 1B? If neither is the case, a conversion from C to 1B is generally easier and will generally be far more successful.

bulldog55 · 02-25-2005, 01:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Malleus Dei

Why turn him into an LF instead of a 1B? Is it because you have a gaping hole in LF, or perhaps you already have a stud 1B? If neither is the case, a conversion from C to 1B is generally easier and will generally be far more successful.

Yeah, what you said. I have a star 1B and a gaping hole in LF.

I think I might take all his points away from Eye since he's a 10. Maybe he'll drop to a 9 or even a high 8 but at 23 he should be able to get it back.

Or I could just trade the good defensive catcher for a leftfielder....

treedom · 02-25-2005, 01:25 PM

I would just stick him in LF till he learns.

bulldog55 · 02-25-2005, 01:42 PM

I just ran a test and converted 7 of 10 catchers to LF in ST, all 7 of them getting a 1 in range. I should have taken age into account but as it was, everyone who made the switch was 26 or younger. The three who didn't were 23, 28 and 32. Considering my catcher is 23, and 7 of 8 catchers under 26 made it, perhaps it's a reasonably safe bet he can make the switch.

Even more interesting is that none of them suffered hits in their eye even though I took all five points from strike zone judgement in all of them. Some of them even improved in that area somehow.

EJ · 02-25-2005, 01:53 PM

You could also try the conversion in AAA, if you can live without him for a few months.

bulldog55 · 02-25-2005, 02:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by EJ

You could also try the conversion in AAA, if you can live without him for a few months.

He was the postseason MVP.

rudel.dietrich · 02-25-2005, 03:00 PM

Learning new posistions is near the top of my list of things to change in version 7.
The previous ways are all crap.

gohorns98 · 02-25-2005, 04:56 PM

Why don't you trade one of your catchers for a Left fielder. A good hitting catcher is worth more then almost any other position. You could get a good hitting Left Fielder and a backup outfielder for him at least.

andjbock · 02-25-2005, 05:30 PM

Can he actually learn the position in OOTP6? I thought you couldn't learn new postions except in the minors and ST.

mrcoach00 · 02-25-2005, 05:45 PM

Something I've noticed while trying to teach players a new position: the higher the arm and range ratings for the positions they can play now, the quicker they will learn a new position and vice versa.
I don't know if this holds true all the time, but just something I have picked up on as I often to try make my minor leaguers more versatile before they get to the show.

Malleus Dei · 02-25-2005, 06:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by treedom

I would just stick him in LF till he learns.

If you can afford to do that, I agree with Tree.

bulldog55 · 02-25-2005, 06:33 PM

Is it an all-or-nothing thing in Spring Training, either they learn it or they don't? If they don't get a fielding rating have they still made progress towards getting one?

TotalEnd98 · 02-25-2005, 06:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bulldog55

Is it an all-or-nothing thing in Spring Training, either they learn it or they don't? If they don't get a fielding rating have they still made progress towards getting one?

As far as I know, it's all or nothing; if he doesn't leave ST with the rating, he is exactly as close to gaining one as he was before ST.

jeheinz72 · 02-25-2005, 07:24 PM

I've had success just playing people there during the regular season, yeah, a few more errors than normal but nothing hideous. Plus if you try that first, it is still an un-doable experiment.

02-25-2005, 02:40 AM	#1
bulldog55 Hall Of Famer Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: California's Canada Warnings: 17 Posts: 2,481	Converting a catcher to leftfield I am looking at going into my next season with two outfielders, if I can move one that I've had on the block for a while. Trading him would be contingent on being able to find a replacement, and I doubt that could come through free agency as our payroll is through the roof. The thing is, I have two excellent catchers. The better of the two offensively is horrible on defense, and I think the team would be better served if he wasn't catching where we could utilise his bat more. So I got to thinking about teaching him leftfield next Spring. Has anyone tried teaching a catcher leftfield? Paul LoDuca and Jason Kendall can play the outfield. I can't imagine it's impossible. What do you think the likelihood is of a 23-year-old catcher learning to play left in one Spring? __________________ Commissioner, Trans-Continental Base Ball Association Owner/GM, Los Angeles Electrics (TCBA), Beaverton Rangers (OTBL), Portland Mavericks (Union League), and Los Angeles Superbas (Century League) Being smart, don't always make you popular.

02-25-2005, 03:04 AM	#2
TheRockCT All Star Starter Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: TN Posts: 1,083	Well, I've had success with it a couple of times. I have more success with C's turning into 1B, but I've also seen a few end up in the OF. It varies for timeframe though, I had one learn it in 2-3 weeks, and another learn it about 3/4th of the way through the season. Since I assume you're going to teach him in the majors and not via ST, your defense in LF will be pitiful until he does learn it, and even then he's a bad catcher defensively, so he'll probably be pretty bad in the OF, too. __________________ GM, Vermont Emperor Penguins - POTD POTD Champions: 2011, 2012, 2013 GM, Monterrey Aztecs* - NABA *NABA Champions: 2013

02-25-2005, 03:06 AM	#3
bulldog55 Hall Of Famer Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: California's Canada Warnings: 17 Posts: 2,481	I was planning on teaching him in ST. He's fully developed already offensively. Can he take talent hits? __________________ Commissioner, Trans-Continental Base Ball Association Owner/GM, Los Angeles Electrics (TCBA), Beaverton Rangers (OTBL), Portland Mavericks (Union League), and Los Angeles Superbas (Century League) Being smart, don't always make you popular.

02-25-2005, 08:34 AM	#5
ctorg Global Moderator Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: Queens, NY Posts: 9,848	Yes, actually. I had a similar situation to yours. I had a great defensive catcher who was a pretty decent hitter (High OBP, no power) and an All-Star catcher with zero defensive skills. I undertook a big project. First, I converted the bad fielding catcher to LF. It worked, but he was really bad. Over the next few years, I gave him defensive points in spring training. He gradually improved until, about 4 or 5 years later, he was actually an average fielder in left. He was really young when I started his conversion (something like 23 or 24), so I'm sure that helped. __________________ My music "When the trees blow back and forth, that's what makes the wind." - Steven Wright Fjord emena pancreas thorax fornicate marmalade morpheme proteolysis smaxa cabana offal srue vitriol grope hallelujah lentils

02-25-2005, 01:25 PM	#9
treedom Hall Of Famer Join Date: May 2002 Location: Transylvania Posts: 2,900	I would just stick him in LF till he learns. __________________ A rake and a roustabout.

02-25-2005, 09:25 AM	#6
Bald Eagles Major Leagues Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: Waveland & Sheffield Posts: 402	If you manually assign this catcher to start everyday in left, he will, at some point, earn a defensive rating in left. As Rock said, you'll have limited defense in left until he officially learns it.

02-25-2005, 01:42 PM	#10
bulldog55 Hall Of Famer Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: California's Canada Warnings: 17 Posts: 2,481	I just ran a test and converted 7 of 10 catchers to LF in ST, all 7 of them getting a 1 in range. I should have taken age into account but as it was, everyone who made the switch was 26 or younger. The three who didn't were 23, 28 and 32. Considering my catcher is 23, and 7 of 8 catchers under 26 made it, perhaps it's a reasonably safe bet he can make the switch. Even more interesting is that none of them suffered hits in their eye even though I took all five points from strike zone judgement in all of them. Some of them even improved in that area somehow. __________________ Commissioner, Trans-Continental Base Ball Association Owner/GM, Los Angeles Electrics (TCBA), Beaverton Rangers (OTBL), Portland Mavericks (Union League), and Los Angeles Superbas (Century League) Being smart, don't always make you popular.

02-25-2005, 01:53 PM	#11
EJ Minors (Double A) Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: Pacific NW, USA Posts: 145	You could also try the conversion in AAA, if you can live without him for a few months.

02-25-2005, 03:00 PM	#13
rudel.dietrich Hall Of Famer Join Date: Jul 2004 Location: Zürich, Switzerland Posts: 8,608	Learning new posistions is near the top of my list of things to change in version 7. The previous ways are all crap.

02-25-2005, 04:56 PM	#14
gohorns98 Minors (Double A) Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: Flower Mound, TX Posts: 194	Why don't you trade one of your catchers for a Left fielder. A good hitting catcher is worth more then almost any other position. You could get a good hitting Left Fielder and a backup outfielder for him at least.

02-25-2005, 05:30 PM	#15
andjbock Hall Of Famer Join Date: Jul 2003 Location: Somerville, MA, USA Bats: Right Throws: Left Posts: 3,640	Can he actually learn the position in OOTP6? I thought you couldn't learn new postions except in the minors and ST.

02-25-2005, 05:45 PM	#16
mrcoach00 Minors (Triple A) Join Date: Sep 2004 Location: Peoria, IL Posts: 217	Something I've noticed while trying to teach players a new position: the higher the arm and range ratings for the positions they can play now, the quicker they will learn a new position and vice versa. I don't know if this holds true all the time, but just something I have picked up on as I often to try make my minor leaguers more versatile before they get to the show.

02-25-2005, 06:33 PM	#18
bulldog55 Hall Of Famer Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: California's Canada Warnings: 17 Posts: 2,481	Is it an all-or-nothing thing in Spring Training, either they learn it or they don't? If they don't get a fielding rating have they still made progress towards getting one? __________________ Commissioner, Trans-Continental Base Ball Association Owner/GM, Los Angeles Electrics (TCBA), Beaverton Rangers (OTBL), Portland Mavericks (Union League), and Los Angeles Superbas (Century League) Being smart, don't always make you popular.

02-25-2005, 07:24 PM	#20
jeheinz72 Hall Of Famer Join Date: Jun 2003 Location: Fresno, CA Posts: 2,164	I've had success just playing people there during the regular season, yeah, a few more errors than normal but nothing hideous. Plus if you try that first, it is still an un-doable experiment. __________________ Join The Dugout!