Out of position subbing....Is there any way.....

[Leefoo]

To prevent a player who isn't rated for a position to come in and play that position. I was hoping this was fixed in 17, but the same thing happens, so I've gone back to 16 (which I prefer).

For instance, I've seen very good OFers come in and play SS. I've seen SS's come in and C and vice versa.

And, once they've played that first game, the AI "smells blood" and puts them back there again and again. I've even edited out the position to no avail.

Also, all this happens when there are legitimate subs on the bench. The AI seems to do this with offensively minded players (for instance, Dick McAuliffe was the player moved to C)

I know that you can force a player to start, but can you force players to NOT play a position?

Thx.

[Déjà Bru]

Not in a positive way, I don't think. Approaching it in a negative fashion:

• Force more players to start at positions
• Tag them in player strategy as to never lift for a pinch hitter
• Build your depth chart so that you have guys who field well and who can hit at least a little bit as backups.

I believe the game will start/sub a poor defensive player or out of position in two situations:

• The guy is so good at the plate that he simply must be in the lineup anywhere possible, even the lowest red defensive ratings (after all, you are "paying" the AI to make this tough decision), or
• The guy that you would prefer to start/sub in that position really is not good offensively at all.

[RchW]

Originally Posted by Déjà Bru

Not in a positive way, I don't think. Approaching it in a negative fashion:

• Force more players to start at positions
• Tag them in player strategy as to never lift for a pinch hitter
• Build your depth chart so that you have guys who field well and who can hit at least a little bit as backups.

I believe the game will start/sub a poor defensive player or out of position in two situations:

• The guy is so good at the plate that he simply must be in the lineup anywhere possible, even the lowest red defensive ratings (after all, you are "paying" the AI to make this tough decision), or
• The guy that you would prefer to start/sub in that position really is not good offensively at all.

I think Leefoo is referring to in-game subs generally. AI roster construction leads to problems like an OF playing SS. Once all positions are covered some teams will, as you say, get bats regardless of positions

[PSUColonel]

Perhaps there needs to be a system where players who are currently in the lineup can also be a sub in the depth chart? Eg...a RF who is also the backup CF

[Matt Arnold]

We have done changes this year so that even if a guy gets a couple games in at a position, if he's not really meant for that role, the AI really won't consider him to start there. So if your OF plays SS for one game, the AI should not necessarily all of a sudden turn him into their starting SS.

In-game, I believe we should hardly ever be playing a guy who's not rated at a position while someone else on the bench is rated there. Now, there are cases where if the in-game substitutions are quite complex, we may not do the big sub. So if your SS gets hurt, and to have everyone in position we need to move your 2B to SS, the 3B to 2B, the RF to 3B, the 1B to RF, and then the new guy comes in to play 1B, we will likely not do that swap.

[Leefoo]

Originally Posted by Matt Arnold

We have done changes this year so that even if a guy gets a couple games in at a position, if he's not really meant for that role, the AI really won't consider him to start there. So if your OF plays SS for one game, the AI should not necessarily all of a sudden turn him into their starting SS.

In-game, I believe we should hardly ever be playing a guy who's not rated at a position while someone else on the bench is rated there. Now, there are cases where if the in-game substitutions are quite complex, we may not do the big sub. So if your SS gets hurt, and to have everyone in position we need to move your 2B to SS, the 3B to 2B, the RF to 3B, the 1B to RF, and then the new guy comes in to play 1B, we will likely not do that swap.

Rich....Thx......now.....If only I was playing v17.

One thing that has seemingly helped is that, since I play mostly historical seasons, is that I try to give teams as many options, at, say, SS as I realistically can.

Hopefully, that won't "force" the AI into a tough decision (esp when there are multiple moves). For instance, there should, in the above example, almost always be a guy who plays SS on the bench. I have given each team a guy or two who plays multiple positions (assuming they did so in their career). They get turned into Cesar Tovar clones.

But, it still irks me (and this may have been fixed in 17....I didn't play it long enough to find out), when an OFer moves in to play SS and a SS already is sitting on the bench.

But, bottom line, this is one of the few quibbles I have with 16. And, when you add in the plethora of old time seasons, I am quite happy overall.

[Anyone]

Originally Posted by Matt Arnold

In-game, I believe we should hardly ever be playing a guy who's not rated at a position while someone else on the bench is rated there..

The AI is still too willing (IMO) to remove a player who is not injured when there is nobody else available who's rated to play there.

Example: Only Two guys on a team are rated at SS. Neither is as good a hitter as backup OF/1B types. In the top of the 7th inning, the first one is pinch hit for, which can make sense. So the backup comes in. In the top of the 9th inning, the backup SS-- who may really be a bad hitter-- comes up. The game is tied, so the AI sees it as a pinch hit situation. It may well be, but only if there's someone to sub for him after he's pinch hit for.

The AI will often pinch hit even if it means the backup corner OF who pinch hit for him has to stay in and play SS, when he's an awful IF (very possibly even a poor defensive OF). To be fair, the game doesn't punish that as extremely as I'd expect on defense. I'd make the defensive punishments extreme, but also the AI not make the sub.

[ConStar]

To be accurate, you have to come up with two sets of rules:

1) Rules for all teams, except...
2) ... rules for teams managed by Joe Maddon.

[ThePretender]

Originally Posted by Anyone

The AI is still too willing (IMO) to remove a player who is not injured when there is nobody else available who's rated to play there.

Example: Only Two guys on a team are rated at SS. Neither is as good a hitter as backup OF/1B types. In the top of the 7th inning, the first one is pinch hit for, which can make sense. So the backup comes in. In the top of the 9th inning, the backup SS-- who may really be a bad hitter-- comes up. The game is tied, so the AI sees it as a pinch hit situation. It may well be, but only if there's someone to sub for him after he's pinch hit for.

The AI will often pinch hit even if it means the backup corner OF who pinch hit for him has to stay in and play SS, when he's an awful IF (very possibly even a poor defensive OF). To be fair, the game doesn't punish that as extremely as I'd expect on defense. I'd make the defensive punishments extreme, but also the AI not make the sub.

If you're losing the game then I'd think the PH situation would be worth it. But if you're winning then you're right, the PH shouldn't happen.

[Orioles1966]

Originally Posted by PSUColonel

Perhaps there needs to be a system where players who are currently in the lineup can also be a sub in the depth chart? Eg...a RF who is also the backup CF

I have requested in the past to have a League Roster Summary Page that would list the number or pitchers,catchers,etc per team that way I would know it if the Washington Nationals only have one catcher or another team doesn't have ay reserve outfielders.


This might prevent players from playing out of position. Right now I have Chris Chambliss and Chuck Hinton as secondbasemen. Chambliss.probably because the team is over run with first basemen and the regular secondbaseman sucks.

[Orioles1966]

Originally Posted by PSUColonel

Perhaps there needs to be a system where players who are currently in the lineup can also be a sub in the depth chart? Eg...a RF who is also the backup CF

I have requested in the past to have a League Roster Summary Page that would list the number or pitchers,catchers,etc per team that way I would know it if the Washington Nationals only have one catcher or another team doesn't have any reserve outfielders.


This might prevent players from playing out of position. Right now I have Chris Chambliss and Chuck Hinton as secondbasemen. Chambliss.probably because the team is over run with first basemen and the regular secondbaseman sucks.

Many times I will began a regular season and a lot of teams will only have a few pitchers on their active roster and I don't catch it until later in the season because it's too time consuming to check 200 team rosters all the time.