Suggestion for pitcher aging curves.

Curtis · 03-04-2016, 09:40 AM

This was posted recently at FanGraphs. I apologize if it has already been mentioned, as I come here rarely these days: Maybe Ground-Ball Pitchers Actually Are a Bad Bet? | FanGraphs Baseball

Markus Heinsohn · 03-04-2016, 11:46 AM

Interesting... I'll have a look, maybe I can sneak this into the aging code of OOTP 17.

pgjocki · 03-04-2016, 11:58 AM

How much does defense factor in though? If the team has weak infielders it may lead to more ground balls getting through and thus more runs.

Hammercraft · 03-04-2016, 12:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pgjocki

How much does defense factor in though? If the team has weak infielders it may lead to more ground balls getting through and thus more runs.

For the modern game, this may be the case. Teams have less interest in solid defenders and will give up some defense in favor off offensive production, leading to lower performance for groundball pitchers. Back in the day you could have a career hitting .230 as a defense-first C, 2B or SS, these days not so much

actionjackson · 03-04-2016, 02:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hammercraft

For the modern game, this may be the case. Teams have less interest in solid defenders and will give up some defense in favor off offensive production, leading to lower performance for groundball pitchers. Back in the day you could have a career hitting .230 as a defense-first C, 2B or SS, these days not so much

To be fair, I think the modern game is getting back to understanding the importance of defense. We did go through a period *cough* steroid era *cough, cough* when nobody gave a rat's behind about defense, but I think teams are back to valuing defense much more highly than they did even 10 years ago.

kungfupandacam · 03-04-2016, 02:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by actionjackson

To be fair, I think the modern game is getting back to understanding the importance of defense. We did go through a period *cough* steroid era *cough, cough* when nobody gave a rat's behind about defense, but I think teams are back to valuing defense much more highly than they did even 10 years ago.

I hope we get out of the era who puts defense to be well nothing. Still that steroid era(I'm looking at you Bonds, Clemens, Sosa, and so many others), kind of messed everything up. Obviously there were more strikeouts than groundouts and we can't defend a home run.(Only if we are spider man) So, now that we are out of that bull, well now there is a thing called a groundball.(WHAT?! A groundball. Those never happen) and another thing called a flyball not out of the park(WHAT?! No homerun)
Spider-man:

TheXumaker · 03-04-2016, 03:08 PM

Mike Trout isn't human

actionjackson · 03-04-2016, 03:09 PM

I think we've come out the other side of that era pretty well, and the methods of quantifying defense are getting better and better, which means we'll be able to separate good defenders from bad defenders much more accurately. Once that happens, teams will begin to pay for it. That's already started to happen though. One need only look at the Jason Heyward, Ben Zobrist, and Alex Gordon deals for proof that the market is starting to value defense.

Meanwhile a slugger like Pedro Alvarez is waiting around for a phone call because he just can't field.

The Wolf · 03-04-2016, 03:10 PM

Of course not, obviously he's a fish.

kungfupandacam · 03-04-2016, 03:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by the wolf

of course not, obviously he's a fish.

lol

03-04-2016, 09:40 AM	#1
Curtis Hall Of Famer Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: Watertown, New York Posts: 4,567	Suggestion for pitcher aging curves. This was posted recently at FanGraphs. I apologize if it has already been mentioned, as I come here rarely these days: Maybe Ground-Ball Pitchers Actually Are a Bad Bet? \| FanGraphs Baseball

03-04-2016, 11:46 AM	#2
Markus Heinsohn Developer OOTP Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: Germany Posts: 24,803	Interesting... I'll have a look, maybe I can sneak this into the aging code of OOTP 17. __________________ Buy Out of the Park Baseball 25 now! Download OOTP Go 25 for iOS Download OOTP Go 25 for Android

03-04-2016, 11:58 AM	#3
pgjocki All Star Starter Join Date: Jun 2013 Location: Maryland - just outside DC Posts: 1,675	How much does defense factor in though? If the team has weak infielders it may lead to more ground balls getting through and thus more runs. __________________ - - - World Series championships: 1926, 1931, 1934, 1942, 1944, 1946, 1964, 1967, 1982, 2006, 2011

03-04-2016, 03:08 PM	#7
TheXumaker Minors (Rookie Ball) Join Date: Mar 2016 Location: California Posts: 29	Mike Trout isn't human

03-04-2016, 03:09 PM	#8
actionjackson Hall Of Famer Join Date: Apr 2009 Location: Toronto, ON Posts: 6,179	I think we've come out the other side of that era pretty well, and the methods of quantifying defense are getting better and better, which means we'll be able to separate good defenders from bad defenders much more accurately. Once that happens, teams will begin to pay for it. That's already started to happen though. One need only look at the Jason Heyward, Ben Zobrist, and Alex Gordon deals for proof that the market is starting to value defense. Meanwhile a slugger like Pedro Alvarez is waiting around for a phone call because he just can't field.