Fielding ratings not importing with neutralized stats

Biggio509 · 06-23-2010, 09:50 PM

When I choose neutralized stats for importing fielding ratings do not import. Is there a workaround for this? I assume it is a bug because it happens with vanilla and other DBs.

SteveP · 06-23-2010, 11:22 PM

Well ... yes, they do import using neut stats. I assume that, if you thought about it, you would realize that must be the case. The question is why they aren't importing in your copy of the game.

Biggio509 · 06-24-2010, 03:01 AM

After further reading I have found there seems to be a bug when you remove the .obd file. I had to do that because I wanted a historical setup. Following Baseball man's post I changed NA and AA to NL and AL in the files so that the NA and NL are a continuous league and AA and AL are a continuous league.

This is a problem when the CVS files are changed and you have to remove the .obd file for the changes to import. It isn't a problem if you don't mod the database. So there is something different in the .odb file and the individual CVS files although the only thing in my case that should be different is the league abbreviations.

As has happened with others removing the .obd file has caused the game to import neutralized stats for pitching and batting fine but you get no field ratings and no positions on players. Neutralized fielding tab under real stats is blank. If you use real stats it works.

The strange thing is if the game imports real stats you can view neutralized fielding under the real stats tab, it imports neutralized and real fielding when you base on real stats! If you base ratings on neutralized stats the neutralized fielding stats do not get imported and you just see a blank page for neutralized fielding! I do not know much about DBs but this is baffling to me why neutralized fielding imports fine when using real stats but when it tries to use the neutralized fielding stats they completely fail to import. My guess is something is wrong with the format of the fielding or fielding2.csv file. It seems something is causing it to fail to import when the game bases ratings on the neutralized fielding file. The problem doesn't exist when using the .odb file.

SteveP · 06-24-2010, 02:17 PM

I see that Spritze has posted a bug report on this issue. So I guess we'll see what Markus thinks about it at some point.

Spritze · 06-24-2010, 11:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SteveP

I see that Spritze has posted a bug report on this issue. So I guess we'll see what Markus thinks about it at some point.

The bug report is marked unconfirmed. Can you confirm the bug report please if you can confirm that the bug indeed exists.

Confirmational Thanks.

SteveP · 06-24-2010, 11:46 PM

No. As I understand it, the problem occurs when one modifies the DB. I couldn't do that even if I wanted to.

There is no problem normally.

Spritze · 06-25-2010, 12:28 AM

Atchally the problem occurs when one merely deletes the odb file from the stats folder. Doing that sends everything into a tizzy. No DB modification necessary.

Tizzitional Thanks?

SteveP · 06-25-2010, 01:09 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Spritze

Atchally the problem occurs when one merely deletes the odb file from the stats folder. Doing that sends everything into a tizzy. No DB modification necessary.

Tizzitional Thanks?

So ...

1. Why would you want to do that, unless you are modifying the DB? Aren't we just talking about collateral damage here?

2. Is this basic issue here: to wit (or not to wit) that you can't point to the master.csv if you want to use neut stats? Is that what this is about?

Spritze · 06-25-2010, 02:11 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SteveP

2. Is this basic issue here: to wit (or not to wit) that you can't point to the master.csv if you want to use neut stats? Is that what this is about?

To Wit. You can't point to the master.csv and have the ratings work consistantly.... period..... sometimes neuts, sometimes non-neuts, depends on the game setup choices the player makes.

As with many OOTP bugs as long as you don't "Play it your way" the game works perfectly. Change from the default choices however and sometimes all heck breaks loose. Nothings worse than a loose heck.

One simple fix would be to remove ALL the csv files and only have the unalterable ODB file available. That would remove some headaches but would also kill the mods players like to "play" around with and as OOTP is a game "playing around with" could be considered to be a good thing.

Bottom Line:
As long as the CSV's are available gamers want them to work as intended.
Intended = the same as the ODB file.

Spritze · 06-25-2010, 02:15 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SteveP

So ...

1. Aren't we just talking about collateral damage here?

I'm not sure what a knee injury has to do with any of this but mine aches when the weather changes if that is of any help.

SteveP · 06-25-2010, 02:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Spritze

To Wit. You can't point to the master.csv and have the ratings work consistantly.... period..... sometimes neuts, sometimes non-neuts, depends on the game setup choices the player makes.

As with many OOTP bugs as long as you don't "Play it your way" the game works perfectly. Change from the default choices however and sometimes all heck breaks loose. Nothings worse than a loose heck.

One simple fix would be to remove ALL the csv files and only have the unalterable ODB file available. That would remove some headaches but would also kill the mods players like to "play" around with and as OOTP is a game "playing around with" could be considered to be a good thing.

Bottom Line:
As long as the CSV's are available gamers want them to work as intended.
Intended = the same as the ODB file.

I don't know -- and have never tried to understand -- the DB methodology in OOTP, but it's possible that this is the best that Markus and Andreas can do and support. That's not an argument for anything, just something worth considering. However, I think you bug write up could be better. You see the OP here as a symptom of a bigger problem (I think), but I don't think the bug report really makes that point clearly.

SteveP · 06-25-2010, 02:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Spritze

I'm not sure what a knee injury has to do with any of this but mine aches when the weather changes if that is of any help.

Well, if you consider the amount of collateral-jerking of the thread-posting variety, I'm surprised that knee injuries aren't more common. But then ... maybe a lot of OOTPers are walking around on crutches and we don't know it (if they move away from the computer for any length of time, of course.

)

Gambo · 06-26-2010, 03:03 AM

Update: I'm looking at this issue and I think we have it knocked down to there clearly being an issue with the game supplied .csv files, virtually making them impossible to use for a custom database.

There are possibly others issues with the game creating fielding ratings but I personally cant be certain there is an issue.

Biggio509 · 06-26-2010, 04:06 AM

Is the teams.csv included in the .odb file? I ask because the instructions for getting the historical NA and AA for OOTP X say you have to change NA and AA to NL and AL in batting, fielding, and pitching files. I am not sure this is necessary in OOTP XI. I have done that but I just realized that although PH1 and CL1 are set as AL in the teams.csv to get the game not freak when it tries to load the DB, all the players for PH1 and CL1 import even though I am certain the league ID for the teams in batting, fielding, and pitching is NL.

Therefore the old instructions seem not necessary because the game seems to be ignoring the league ID when importing and just importing players based on team ID. If I can just mod the teams.csv and leave the .odb file then there should be no problem. Not to start a historical game teams have to be labeled NL or AL. I tried with just NA and the DB will not load. So the teams.csv seems to be the only place where abbreviations need to be changed. Mod league structure after creating and empty the AL but don't delete and things run fine.

If I can find the teams.csv in the .odb file I suppose I could just mod it there since it is not a huge change.

The only other slight PITA right now other than neutralized stats is when teams fold, which happens a lot in the 19th century. The game makes the teams inactive but players remain on the team so you have to manually release the players by player searching and clicking on the defunct teams names next to players and then you can release the players or editing each player to make them a free agent.

Spritze · 06-26-2010, 07:02 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Biggio509

Is the teams.csv included in the .odb file?

Yes

Biggio509 · 06-26-2010, 11:58 AM

I tried opening the .odb in base from opening office. The teams section has swedish characters and characters with umlats before the years is some sort of import error?

example

Û#1968 NL SLN STL NULL 1 162 81 97 65 NULL NULL Y N 583 5561 1383 227 48 73 378 897 110 45 NULL NULL 472 409 2.49 63 30 32 4437 1282 82 375 971 140 135 0.978 St. Louis Cardinals Busch Stadium II 2011167 99 97 STL SLN SLN Is the character before the # something that did not import right or is it necessary?

06-26-2010, 03:03 AM	#13
Gambo Hall Of Famer Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Oklahoma Posts: 2,388	Update: I'm looking at this issue and I think we have it knocked down to there clearly being an issue with the game supplied .csv files, virtually making them impossible to use for a custom database. There are possibly others issues with the game creating fielding ratings but I personally cant be certain there is an issue. __________________ *Give me league evolution with historical imports!!!* OOTP MODS: Historical Face Gen Project, Spritze/Gambo Database, OOTP Stadium Chart and Ballpark Images, MLB Compiled Uniform & Logo Pack available at... http://www.ootpmods.com

06-23-2010, 09:50 PM	#1
Biggio509 Hall Of Famer Join Date: Aug 2007 Posts: 2,027	Fielding ratings not importing with neutralized stats When I choose neutralized stats for importing fielding ratings do not import. Is there a workaround for this? I assume it is a bug because it happens with vanilla and other DBs.

06-23-2010, 11:22 PM	#2
SteveP Moderator Join Date: Aug 2008 Posts: 3,109	Well ... yes, they do import using neut stats. I assume that, if you thought about it, you would realize that must be the case. The question is why they aren't importing in your copy of the game.

06-24-2010, 03:01 AM	#3
Biggio509 Hall Of Famer Join Date: Aug 2007 Posts: 2,027	After further reading I have found there seems to be a bug when you remove the .obd file. I had to do that because I wanted a historical setup. Following Baseball man's post I changed NA and AA to NL and AL in the files so that the NA and NL are a continuous league and AA and AL are a continuous league. This is a problem when the CVS files are changed and you have to remove the .obd file for the changes to import. It isn't a problem if you don't mod the database. So there is something different in the .odb file and the individual CVS files although the only thing in my case that should be different is the league abbreviations. As has happened with others removing the .obd file has caused the game to import neutralized stats for pitching and batting fine but you get no field ratings and no positions on players. Neutralized fielding tab under real stats is blank. If you use real stats it works. The strange thing is if the game imports real stats you can view neutralized fielding under the real stats tab, it imports neutralized and real fielding when you base on real stats! If you base ratings on neutralized stats the neutralized fielding stats do not get imported and you just see a blank page for neutralized fielding! I do not know much about DBs but this is baffling to me why neutralized fielding imports fine when using real stats but when it tries to use the neutralized fielding stats they completely fail to import. My guess is something is wrong with the format of the fielding or fielding2.csv file. It seems something is causing it to fail to import when the game bases ratings on the neutralized fielding file. The problem doesn't exist when using the .odb file.

06-24-2010, 02:17 PM	#4
SteveP Moderator Join Date: Aug 2008 Posts: 3,109	I see that Spritze has posted a bug report on this issue. So I guess we'll see what Markus thinks about it at some point.

06-24-2010, 11:46 PM	#6
SteveP Moderator Join Date: Aug 2008 Posts: 3,109	No. As I understand it, the problem occurs when one modifies the DB. I couldn't do that even if I wanted to. There is no problem normally.

06-25-2010, 12:28 AM	#7
Spritze OOTP Historical Czar Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: Bothell Wa Posts: 7,253	Atchally the problem occurs when one merely deletes the odb file from the stats folder. Doing that sends everything into a tizzy. No DB modification necessary. Tizzitional Thanks?

06-26-2010, 04:06 AM	#14
Biggio509 Hall Of Famer Join Date: Aug 2007 Posts: 2,027	Is the teams.csv included in the .odb file? I ask because the instructions for getting the historical NA and AA for OOTP X say you have to change NA and AA to NL and AL in batting, fielding, and pitching files. I am not sure this is necessary in OOTP XI. I have done that but I just realized that although PH1 and CL1 are set as AL in the teams.csv to get the game not freak when it tries to load the DB, all the players for PH1 and CL1 import even though I am certain the league ID for the teams in batting, fielding, and pitching is NL. Therefore the old instructions seem not necessary because the game seems to be ignoring the league ID when importing and just importing players based on team ID. If I can just mod the teams.csv and leave the .odb file then there should be no problem. Not to start a historical game teams have to be labeled NL or AL. I tried with just NA and the DB will not load. So the teams.csv seems to be the only place where abbreviations need to be changed. Mod league structure after creating and empty the AL but don't delete and things run fine. If I can find the teams.csv in the .odb file I suppose I could just mod it there since it is not a huge change. The only other slight PITA right now other than neutralized stats is when teams fold, which happens a lot in the 19th century. The game makes the teams inactive but players remain on the team so you have to manually release the players by player searching and clicking on the defunct teams names next to players and then you can release the players or editing each player to make them a free agent.

06-26-2010, 11:58 AM	#16
Biggio509 Hall Of Famer Join Date: Aug 2007 Posts: 2,027	I tried opening the .odb in base from opening office. The teams section has swedish characters and characters with umlats before the years is some sort of import error? example Û#1968 NL SLN STL NULL 1 162 81 97 65 NULL NULL Y N 583 5561 1383 227 48 73 378 897 110 45 NULL NULL 472 409 2.49 63 30 32 4437 1282 82 375 971 140 135 0.978 St. Louis Cardinals Busch Stadium II 2011167 99 97 STL SLN SLN Is the character before the # something that did not import right or is it necessary?