Historical MilB before 1915

[boscoJJ]

Will ootp 23 contains Historical MilB Minor Leagues before 1915?
If so i would buy it

[BigRed75]

Before 1915, there were no affiliations. All minor leagues were independent. So I really doubt you'll see that

[WestCoastGuy]

Why would all minor leagues being independent cause them to not be included for that reason?

[AESP_pres]

Originally Posted by BigRed75

Before 1915, there were no affiliations. All minor leagues were independent. So I really doubt you'll see that

To be honest most teams in the minor league until 1932 were unaffiliated, so this isn't really a reason why they aren't there before 1915.

Now a more logical reason is that the team stats aren't available, in theory you can build the minor league starting in 1882 I think (not 100% positive of the first year) with the real players but the leagues has no W-L records so it's hard to build a realist schedule.

[BigRed75]

Originally Posted by AESP_pres

To be honest most teams in the minor league until 1932 were unaffiliated, so this isn't really a reason why they aren't there before 1915.

Now a more logical reason is that the team stats aren't available, in theory you can build the minor league starting in 1882 I think (not 100% positive of the first year) with the real players but the leagues has no W-L records so it's hard to build a realist schedule.

But some were affiliated, which is why they start showing up then

[BigRed75]

Originally Posted by WestCoastGuy

Why would all minor leagues being independent cause them to not be included for that reason?

Because the way the database is set up, at least one team needs to be affiliated for the minor league to work. Otherwise, you have a bunch of independent leagues, which don't have affiliations. And then what to do you when those teams start to be affiliated in actual history? Independent leagues don't support affiliation (that's why they're independent) so that won't work.

The International League, for example, was around in 1915, but doesn't show up in the game then because none of the teams had an affiliation.

[thehef]

It was previously & officially requested that the significant minors in the early 1900's - primarily PCL from 1903-1920, Int'l Lg (aka Eastern Lg 1901-1911) thru 1926, American Association from 1902-1931, Texas League from 1902-1918, and a few others - be added. It's been semi-tested out by Tiger Fan and myself and it pretty much/sorta works.

I can't speak to exactly where this is on the priority list, but my guess is that it will be at least considered for a post-23-release patch. At least that's my hope

[AESP_pres]

Originally Posted by BigRed75

Because the way the database is set up, at least one team needs to be affiliated for the minor league to work. Otherwise, you have a bunch of independent leagues, which don't have affiliations. And then what to do you when those teams start to be affiliated in actual history?

Same as the game actually do when the unaffiliated team in the Texas League start affiliated after some years... only two teams are affiliated when the league show up first in the game.

Also by your logic how do you explain the Federal League and the Negro Leagues? None of them are affiliated, they are both independent minor leagues going by the game logic and shouldn't be in the game by your logic if you can't have unaffiliated leagues...

Whatever a league is or isn't affiliated isn't relevant... some years ago I played with the 19th century minor leagues (not all of them but some) manually created with the real players and it worked fine, I just stop doing it because it was a pain in the ass to do all that manually every seasons and, to be honest, I think the minor league system is a mess since it doesn't work with the transaction system.

[thehef]

Originally Posted by AESP_pres

I think the minor league system is a mess since it doesn't work with the transaction system.

Creating a minor-league transaction system would not be an easy endeavor, however it would not be nearly as difficult as some might think. It can definitely be done without knowing exact transactions dates (many of which can never be known), and without having to individually determine dates for every single transaction that ever occurred. (Hint: Most transactions occur in the offseason. For a minor league historical replay, who cares exactly when that offseason transaction occurred?)

As for minors being a mess, several things have been suggested that can improve them. Hopefully some of them will be implemented, and I strongly suspect at least a few of them will be, soon. Part of the problem, I suspect, is that few people use minors so there's no real demand to improve them. But of course, gamers don't use minors because they are an inflexible mess I still have hope, though!

[AESP_pres]

To be honest I'd be happy with just "you play there this year and the team can't release or trade you if it didn't happen in real life" + the minor leagues can't sign free agent just like the teams in the major don't if the move isn't listed in the transaction file.

Just that and I'd play with the minor leagues but it isn't fun when a minor league team release a real life prospect just because it feels like it...

[thehef]

Originally Posted by AESP_pres

To be honest I'd be happy with just "you play there this year and the team can't release or trade you if it didn't happen in real life" + the minor leagues can't sign free agent just like the teams in the major don't if the move isn't listed in the transaction file.

Just that and I'd play with the minor leagues but it isn't fun when a minor league team release a real life prospect just because it feels like it...

Well, part of the reason I think that a MiLB transaction system would be doable is because I'm thinking many feel like you (and I) do: They want historical minor leagues to be workable, but they don't have to be perfect