Three-pitcher no-hitter, unnoticed

M's rule · 08-04-2004, 02:31 AM

Half anecdote, half complaint.

Tonight my sim is interrupted with the news that “Chad Bradford is working on a no-hitter.” Well, I know who Chad Bradford is, and his chances of throwing a no-hitter are about as good as mine.

I go to the game. Top of the 9th, Toronto at Oakland. A’s lead 1-0, and now Arthur Rhodes is on the mound instead of Bradford. He makes short work of the Jays to finish the no-hitter.

Lost in all of this is the fact that Rich Harden pitched the first seven innings. He struck out the side in order in the top of the 7th, and his reward for that was to get pulled by the AI in favor of the aforementioned Bradford, who started and finished the 8th without incident.

Harden threw 105 pitches before being yanked, and yes, he was tired (endurance 62). And yes, it was a 1-0 game—but jeez, he had a no-hitter going!

I’ve read stories on this board about the converse of this situation, when the AI left a starter in after he became tired while he had a no-hitter going, seemingly only for that reason. Maybe those games weren’t as close as my 1-0 thriller, or maybe other factors I’m not aware of came into play. Still, seems a shame that Harden didn’t get a chance to see it through.

The bigger shame, in a way, is that this game gets no mention in the league news. To me, that’s like Houston not getting media coverage the day after they no-hit the Yankees, because they did it with five pitchers instead of one.

I can understand why the coding to describe this game in detailed story form (including stats) might be a lot more trouble than it’s worth, but I’d still like to see the game noted somehow: “Oakland accomplished a baseball rarity today when pitchers Moe, Larry, and Curly kept Toronto from getting a hit.”

Harden’s performance (12 Ks, 3 BBs) earned him an 86 score, which is good for 10th place on the list so far (it’s June 6, a little more than two months into the season). Everyone above him on the list pitched a complete game (and in fairness, three of the top 9 are 1-hitters), but it seems like 7 innings of no-hit ball warrants more recognition than this. Again, this is probably tough to account for in the coding that determines top performances (which seems to be entirely number-driven).

BTW, to get back to Rhodes vis-a-vis Bradford, this is far from the first time when I’ve seen a message that “Joe is on the verge of something great,” only to blip to the game and find out that Joe isn’t in the game anymore. Typically for me, this happens when a hitter is looking at his fourth HR in the game or his 2,000th hit or whatever—I go to witness the rest of the game, only to discover that Joe has just been lifted for a pinch hitter. I’d guess this happens more often with the 2,000th hit guy than with the 4 HR-in-a-game-guy, because for the 2,000th hit guy, there’s always tomorrow—but in any case, it’s disappointing to find out that Joe’s already on the bench when I start to watch the end of the game.

Thoughts?

Skipaway · 08-04-2004, 04:31 AM

Chad Bradford was indeed working on a no-hitter when you were informed. It's not "Joe is on the verge of something great", but rather " Joe is working on something great".

The game just let John finished that something great instead of Joe.

andjbock · 08-04-2004, 12:27 PM

That's why you gotta play 'em all out.

ctorg · 08-04-2004, 12:30 PM

Well, the game's news system should get a total overhaul for the next version. It currently sucks, as has been said many times. I'm hoping OOTP7 has a much better story generator, ideally one that allows for customization.

Fool Inc. · 08-04-2004, 12:47 PM

As said before, with the SI merger/take over

the news system will get revamped.

sixto · 08-04-2004, 02:19 PM

Actually with the current fascination with pitch counts, you're going to see more and more shared no-hitters and shutouts. However, for historical purposes, there is absolutely a need for the AI to be aware of things like this.

dsvitak · 08-04-2004, 02:24 PM

Yeah, a nerve got hit here. No pitcher should be taken out of a game, while throwing a no-hitter. I cannot imagine even one scenario where this should happen.

Well I can, say its the 12 inning, and his arm is falling off. Thats about it, though.

ctorg · 08-04-2004, 02:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dsvitak

Yeah, a nerve got hit here. No pitcher should be taken out of a game, while throwing a no-hitter. I cannot imagine even one scenario where this should happen.

Well I can, say its the 12 inning, and his arm is falling off. Thats about it, though.

And if his head spontaneously explodes, splattering brains all over the infield.

cgh3rd · 08-04-2004, 03:13 PM

If the game is on the line and the pitcher and/or his teammates have worked themselves into a jam and the guy is obviously losing it the right move should be made for the team. There have been many near no hitters that teams lost the game because of this notion of attaining an individual accomplishment at the expense of the team as a whole.

Quote:

Originally Posted by dsvitak

Yeah, a nerve got hit here. No pitcher should be taken out of a game, while throwing a no-hitter. I cannot imagine even one scenario where this should happen.

Well I can, say its the 12 inning, and his arm is falling off. Thats about it, though.

08-04-2004, 02:31 AM	#1
M's rule All Star Reserve Join Date: Jul 2003 Location: Seattle Posts: 925	Three-pitcher no-hitter, unnoticed Half anecdote, half complaint. Tonight my sim is interrupted with the news that “Chad Bradford is working on a no-hitter.” Well, I know who Chad Bradford is, and his chances of throwing a no-hitter are about as good as mine. I go to the game. Top of the 9th, Toronto at Oakland. A’s lead 1-0, and now Arthur Rhodes is on the mound instead of Bradford. He makes short work of the Jays to finish the no-hitter. Lost in all of this is the fact that Rich Harden pitched the first seven innings. He struck out the side in order in the top of the 7th, and his reward for that was to get pulled by the AI in favor of the aforementioned Bradford, who started and finished the 8th without incident. Harden threw 105 pitches before being yanked, and yes, he was tired (endurance 62). And yes, it was a 1-0 game—but jeez, he had a no-hitter going! I’ve read stories on this board about the converse of this situation, when the AI left a starter in after he became tired while he had a no-hitter going, seemingly only for that reason. Maybe those games weren’t as close as my 1-0 thriller, or maybe other factors I’m not aware of came into play. Still, seems a shame that Harden didn’t get a chance to see it through. The bigger shame, in a way, is that this game gets no mention in the league news. To me, that’s like Houston not getting media coverage the day after they no-hit the Yankees, because they did it with five pitchers instead of one. I can understand why the coding to describe this game in detailed story form (including stats) might be a lot more trouble than it’s worth, but I’d still like to see the game noted somehow: “Oakland accomplished a baseball rarity today when pitchers Moe, Larry, and Curly kept Toronto from getting a hit.” Harden’s performance (12 Ks, 3 BBs) earned him an 86 score, which is good for 10th place on the list so far (it’s June 6, a little more than two months into the season). Everyone above him on the list pitched a complete game (and in fairness, three of the top 9 are 1-hitters), but it seems like 7 innings of no-hit ball warrants more recognition than this. Again, this is probably tough to account for in the coding that determines top performances (which seems to be entirely number-driven). BTW, to get back to Rhodes vis-a-vis Bradford, this is far from the first time when I’ve seen a message that “Joe is on the verge of something great,” only to blip to the game and find out that Joe isn’t in the game anymore. Typically for me, this happens when a hitter is looking at his fourth HR in the game or his 2,000th hit or whatever—I go to witness the rest of the game, only to discover that Joe has just been lifted for a pinch hitter. I’d guess this happens more often with the 2,000th hit guy than with the 4 HR-in-a-game-guy, because for the 2,000th hit guy, there’s always tomorrow—but in any case, it’s disappointing to find out that Joe’s already on the bench when I start to watch the end of the game. Thoughts?

08-04-2004, 04:31 AM	#2
Skipaway Hall Of Famer Join Date: Apr 2003 Location: Where you live Posts: 11,017	Chad Bradford was indeed working on a no-hitter when you were informed. It's not "Joe is on the verge of something great", but rather " Joe is working on something great". The game just let John finished that something great instead of Joe. __________________ Jonathan Haidt: Moral reasoning is really just a servant masquerading as a high priest.

08-04-2004, 12:30 PM	#4
ctorg Global Moderator Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: Queens, NY Posts: 9,848	Well, the game's news system should get a total overhaul for the next version. It currently sucks, as has been said many times. I'm hoping OOTP7 has a much better story generator, ideally one that allows for customization. __________________ My music "When the trees blow back and forth, that's what makes the wind." - Steven Wright Fjord emena pancreas thorax fornicate marmalade morpheme proteolysis smaxa cabana offal srue vitriol grope hallelujah lentils

08-04-2004, 12:27 PM	#3
andjbock Hall Of Famer Join Date: Jul 2003 Location: Somerville, MA, USA Bats: Right Throws: Left Posts: 3,640	That's why you gotta play 'em all out.

08-04-2004, 12:47 PM	#5
Fool Inc. Major Leagues Join Date: Apr 2004 Location: Dearborn Heights, MI Posts: 342	As said before, with the SI merger/take over the news system will get revamped.

08-04-2004, 02:19 PM	#6
sixto Hall Of Famer Join Date: Jul 2002 Posts: 2,271	Actually with the current fascination with pitch counts, you're going to see more and more shared no-hitters and shutouts. However, for historical purposes, there is absolutely a need for the AI to be aware of things like this.

08-04-2004, 02:24 PM	#7
dsvitak Hall Of Famer Join Date: Dec 2002 Posts: 5,398	Yeah, a nerve got hit here. No pitcher should be taken out of a game, while throwing a no-hitter. I cannot imagine even one scenario where this should happen. Well I can, say its the 12 inning, and his arm is falling off. Thats about it, though.