Jacob Misiorowski question

[Buchs]

I am a little confused about his stuff rating.

His pitches are all really highly rated and he has 100+ velocity why is his stuff rating only in the low 130s. I would expect it to be much higher. What is keeping down?

[Buchs]

Take Dwight Gooden as a comparison

Gooden has slightly less velocity, and his best pitch is about 20 points higher than Misiorowski’s, but average pitch quality is roughly similar, but Goodens Stuff is 174.

Is it because he has 4 quality pitches rather than 3?

[bailey]

Check the release date. Ratings are weaker the older the card is.

[Buchs]

Maybe I am working on a false assumption, but I always thought stuff rating was a calculated number from pitches and velocity based on the manual. Which wouldn’t matter when it was released because the pitch rating and velocity are what they are.

Stuff
Stuff is a measure of the quality of a pitcher's pitch repertoire. Think of it as essentially how a pitcher "puts it all together." Stuff directly affects the number of strikeouts a pitcher throws. Stuff is calculated based on a combination of his individual pitch ratings and the velocity with which he throws

[cwhitman]

there's something weird with the velocity and pitch ratings and how it corresponds. luckily, for PT it isn't particularly relevant to care about

[Buchs]

So ultimately the question is what should I pay attention to, the stuff rating, or that he has 3 outstanding pitches and great velocity.

Because based on things I look at stuff/movement(especially PBABIP, and control, I don’t think he cracks my rotation. However if his stuff was 150ish like it seems like it should be he would.

Does the card actually perform ok in gold tiers or low diamond? There are a handful in my high gold league and none seem to be doing great, so this small sample size makes me think the stuff rating is more useful than looking at velocity and pitch rating. But that’s what I’m trying to figure out.

[cwhitman]

Originally Posted by Buchs

So ultimately the question is what should I pay attention to, the stuff rating, or that he has 3 outstanding pitches and great velocity.

Because based on things I look at stuff/movement(especially PBABIP, and control, I don’t think he cracks my rotation. However if his stuff was 150ish like it seems like it should be he would.

Does the card actually perform ok in gold tiers or low diamond? There are a handful in my high gold league and none seem to be doing great, so this small sample size makes me think the stuff rating is more useful than looking at velocity and pitch rating. But that’s what I’m trying to figure out.

velocity and pitch ratings make up stuff: you are getting no new information out of that.

[Buchs]

Originally Posted by cwhitman

velocity and pitch ratings make up stuff: you are getting no new information out of that.

Exactly what I thought, so this circles back to my original question, why is Misiorowski’s stuff so low compared to other cards with high velocity and high pitch ratings.

[Buchs]

NM, disregard my previous comment. I looked more closely at other cards and it’s not just misiorowski. I think that at least in perfect team the pitch ratings and velocity must not really be directly related to stuff.

Take Mitch Williams (54) as an example. He has two pitches rated 84 and 109 with velocity 90-92 and stuff rating of 170.

And Jhoan Duran is in the same boat as Misiorowski’s, good pitches, 100 velocity but his stuff is even lower than Misiorowski’s .

So I guess to answer my own question, I was probably just wrong about velocity and pitch rating being tied to stuff.

Unfortunately this leads me to another question of does velocity and pitch rating even matter to the sim engine and if so how to evaluate its importance.

I always assumed velocity was baked into stuff so didn’t really worry about it separately, now that doesn’t seem to be the case.

[LeeD]

In theory, velocity and pitch ratings should be the underpinnings of stuff. In PT reality, stuff is stuff, mostly regardless of the underlying ratings. It's all fudged and heavily dependent on release date and attendant ratings creep as the yearly cycle plays out.

[bailey]

Originally Posted by LeeD

In theory, velocity and pitch ratings should be the underpinnings of stuff. In PT reality, stuff is stuff, mostly regardless of the underlying ratings. It's all fudged and heavily dependent on release date and attendant ratings creep as the yearly cycle plays out.

The only way pitch ratings have any meaning is if each hitter has separate batting ratings for each pitch type. Since these hypothetical ratings, if they exist, are state secrets, there is no way for the player to use them strategically.

[cwhitman]

Originally Posted by LeeD

In theory, velocity and pitch ratings should be the underpinnings of stuff. In PT reality, stuff is stuff, mostly regardless of the underlying ratings. It's all fudged and heavily dependent on release date and attendant ratings creep as the yearly cycle plays out.

no: paul has to set the pitch ratings and that influences stuff.

the thing that makes a difference (that i brought up earlier this year to paul) was this comparison. Basically, if you have higher velocity, it exists in your pitch ratings or something but doesn't increase stuff. Hence why these two guys have similar stuff but dramatically different pitch ratings. But for PT it doesn't matter as far as we know.

[LeeD]

So what, precisely, are you saying here? Velo increases pitch ratings but isn't increasing stuff, or...the velo component is being discounted after the fact when calculating stuff. As a result, the stuff rating for high-velo pitchers undershoots its component ratings.

The big question: does the game use stuff or the underlying ratings when determining strikeouts? I'm thinking the former based on card performance, which means we should ignore pitch ratings for the most part. Doesn't really matter whether they're fudged intentionally or unintentionally.

[rburgh]

Is that the the ratings are faked so that they can put out a Honus Wagner card as the grand topper for the Live missions, and have missions to boost him to Variant level 5 when the production of the lesser SS's start approaching his level, in July, and then by October even that card is of marginal value to top tier teams.

Why? Because if they handed out a card to an all-time great in the first month of the season, and never made a better one for any other player at his position, people who spend money to acquire the best cards would have one less position to spend for. And in the corporate world, failing to increase year over year revenue gets you fired.

And without Markus running things, this is very much a bottom-line driven enterprise.

[cwhitman]

Originally Posted by rburgh

Is that the the ratings are faked so that they can put out a Honus Wagner card as the grand topper for the Live missions, and have missions to boost him to Variant level 5 when the production of the lesser SS's start approaching his level, in July, and then by October even that card is of marginal value to top tier teams.

Why? Because if they handed out a card to an all-time great in the first month of the season, and never made a better one for any other player at his position, people who spend money to acquire the best cards would have one less position to spend for. And in the corporate world, failing to increase year over year revenue gets you fired.

And without Markus running things, this is very much a bottom-line driven enterprise.

no, the point of that is because it's boring for the good cards to be the same good cards every year

[usa_hank]

Originally Posted by rburgh

Is that the the ratings are faked so that they can put out a Honus Wagner card as the grand topper for the Live missions, and have missions to boost him to Variant level 5 when the production of the lesser SS's start approaching his level, in July, and then by October even that card is of marginal value to top tier teams.

Why? Because if they handed out a card to an all-time great in the first month of the season, and never made a better one for any other player at his position, people who spend money to acquire the best cards would have one less position to spend for. And in the corporate world, failing to increase year over year revenue gets you fired.

And without Markus running things, this is very much a bottom-line driven enterprise.

I love you for saying this. :P

[Fabtron7]

Originally Posted by rburgh

And without Markus running things, this is very much a bottom-line driven enterprise.

I love all that Markus did but he's basically cashed out and walked away, so I'm not sure you can be more bottom-line driven than that.