Early Retirement. Anyway to stop it?

[toddr037]

Is there any way to stop a player from retiring? Every single season I play in both this years game and last year's, Tyler Ennis, 30 and 31 years young always retires after the first season. Why is this? Is there a stat that's low that I can edit via the editor to keep his desire to keep playing?

[Lappaacco]

Sometimes this is really annoying. In my save 33 year old Petr Mrazek just won Vezina trophy and after the season he retired. Pretty unrealistic I think.

[Danielg342]

I'd also like to know if there's a way to do this. Retired players don't have the option to edit them so I can't seem to "un-retire" anyone.

[DFyvie]

Originally Posted by Lappaacco

Sometimes this is really annoying. In my save 33 year old Petr Mrazek just won Vezina trophy and after the season he retired. Pretty unrealistic I think.

Ken Dryden retiring was also pretty unrealistic to a lot of people.

[Adam B]

Originally Posted by DFyvie

Ken Dryden retiring was also pretty unrealistic to a lot of people.

Every year we have people who think players are retiring too early; but the thing is - the game is changing. Players aren't playing until their 40 anymore - or not many. Many don't have that chance. Teams move on, players want too much money, or the cap plays in.

Now sometimes what you do makes a difference (like if a player is a UFA, there's a substantial better chance they will retire then if they are contracted), but it's not out of line.

I'm pretty sure you can go back into the FHM6 forums and find someone saying the same thing because Crawford retired in their game at the end of their first year and how "unrealistic" that was and I said this exact same thing. Ennis is a guy who is now 30+, on the downside of his career, only been playing for basically league minimum and only on one year deals for the last couple of years. It's more than possible he's out of the NHL whether retired or no one signs him next offseason.

[AdequateRandomGaming]

Originally Posted by Adam B

Every year we have people who think players are retiring too early; but the thing is - the game is changing. Players aren't playing until their 40 anymore - or not many. Many don't have that chance. Teams move on, players want too much money, or the cap plays in.

Now sometimes what you do makes a difference (like if a player is a UFA, there's a substantial better chance they will retire then if they are contracted), but it's not out of line.

I'm pretty sure you can go back into the FHM6 forums and find someone saying the same thing because Crawford retired in their game at the end of their first year and how "unrealistic" that was and I said this exact same thing. Ennis is a guy who is now 30+, on the downside of his career, only been playing for basically league minimum and only on one year deals for the last couple of years. It's more than possible he's out of the NHL whether retired or no one signs him next offseason.

I think what could potentially help people make sense of those early retirement is if the news generated would explain the reason behind it. Age, talent decline, injury, lack of interest by teams, lack of an opportunity on a given team or the player just moving on with other things.
I just simmed the 1994 offseason of my Tampa Bay historical challenge today, and Wayne McBean (who, granted, is not all that good) retired at 25. If there could be an explanation (he was with the Isles, maybe there's no room on D with them, or maybe he had a big injury, etc.) that would help with immersion.
Just food for thought.

[Adam B]

Originally Posted by AdequateRandomGaming

I think what could potentially help people make sense of those early retirement is if the news generated would explain the reason behind it. Age, talent decline, injury, lack of interest by teams, lack of an opportunity on a given team or the player just moving on with other things.
I just simmed the 1994 offseason of my Tampa Bay historical challenge today, and Wayne McBean (who, granted, is not all that good) retired at 25. If there could be an explanation (he was with the Isles, maybe there's no room on D with them, or maybe he had a big injury, etc.) that would help with immersion.
Just food for thought.

The stats usually tell a story and looking at a player history can tell you enough. There are some storylines with players moving on to other things though, just as there are for coaches/scouts.

As for McBean - If you're playing a Challenge Recalc is on and he was retired by that point, which is why he retired.

[Ilkka Scora Goala]

Originally Posted by AdequateRandomGaming

I think what could potentially help people make sense of those early retirement is if the news generated would explain the reason behind it. Age, talent decline, injury, lack of interest by teams, lack of an opportunity on a given team or the player just moving on with other things.
I just simmed the 1994 offseason of my Tampa Bay historical challenge today, and Wayne McBean (who, granted, is not all that good) retired at 25. If there could be an explanation (he was with the Isles, maybe there's no room on D with them, or maybe he had a big injury, etc.) that would help with immersion.
Just food for thought.

Yeah. In 2026, as the Flyers GM and Coach, I just negotiated extensions for Giroux, vanRiemsdyk, and Couturier. About 2 months later, at the end of the season, all three retired. Giroux was 39 but was producing well. VanRiemsdyk didn’t surprise me other than asking for a one-year deal. Couturier was 34 and producing like his prime years. That one did surprise me but I luckily had some youth in AHL that could come up just a little early.

[Mancandy]

Originally Posted by Adam B

Every year we have people who think players are retiring too early; but the thing is - the game is changing. Players aren't playing until their 40 anymore - or not many. Many don't have that chance. Teams move on, players want too much money, or the cap plays in.

Now sometimes what you do makes a difference (like if a player is a UFA, there's a substantial better chance they will retire then if they are contracted), but it's not out of line.

I'm pretty sure you can go back into the FHM6 forums and find someone saying the same thing because Crawford retired in their game at the end of their first year and how "unrealistic" that was and I said this exact same thing. Ennis is a guy who is now 30+, on the downside of his career, only been playing for basically league minimum and only on one year deals for the last couple of years. It's more than possible he's out of the NHL whether retired or no one signs him next offseason.

It took you seven years to figure out that expansion teams are supposed to participate in the entry draft before their first season, so you have absolutely no room to talk about “realism” in this game.

Originally Posted by Adam B

The stats usually tell a story and looking at a player history can tell you enough. There are some storylines with players moving on to other things though, just as there are for coaches/scouts.

As for McBean - If you're playing a Challenge Recalc is on and he was retired by that point, which is why he retired.

We shouldn’t have to “look at a player history” to tell us. When Corey Crawford announced his retirement, he didn’t say “look at my stats and history and that’ll tell you why I retired.” He gave us a clear, understandable, relatable reason. When people make suggestions to improve immersion, your response shouldn’t be an immediate dismissible, it should be taking it into consideration, or at least saying that, even if you don’t plan on doing so. And while I’m here, when somebody asks a question like OP did - simple yes or no question - your response shouldn’t be to completely ignore them in favor of jumping down the throat of the first reply because they used a word that got under your skin. It’s not hard to be friendly and engaging with customers(if you can’t do it, that’s fine, customer service isn’t for everybody, but you probably shouldn’t be interacting with customers on behalf of the game if you can’t) and I guarantee this type of behavior drives people away from the board and away from the game.

OP, as far as I know, there’s no single stat that is the difference between retiring or not. I haven’t bought this year’s version yet(waiting for opening night rosters) but what I would do if I were you is compare Ennis(or anybody else you want to stop from retiring) to similar players in age and skill who don’t retire and see what the difference is. If you really want him to continue playing for whatever reason, drastically edit him(give him a huge contract, radically increase his skills, whatever), and then change him back after simming past the retirements.

[Danielg342]

Originally Posted by Adam B

Every year we have people who think players are retiring too early; but the thing is - the game is changing. Players aren't playing until their 40 anymore - or not many. Many don't have that chance. Teams move on, players want too much money, or the cap plays in.

Now sometimes what you do makes a difference (like if a player is a UFA, there's a substantial better chance they will retire then if they are contracted), but it's not out of line.

I'm pretty sure you can go back into the FHM6 forums and find someone saying the same thing because Crawford retired in their game at the end of their first year and how "unrealistic" that was and I said this exact same thing. Ennis is a guy who is now 30+, on the downside of his career, only been playing for basically league minimum and only on one year deals for the last couple of years. It's more than possible he's out of the NHL whether retired or no one signs him next offseason.

Players also come out of retirement from time to time. I know he's not a hockey player but Jason Witten did.

Here's the thing. Sometimes there's a player I like and I'd like to keep him around. Yeah, it's not "realistic" but some of us don't want to play with absolute 100% realism. We'd still like to see if Wayne Gretzky can produce as a hockey player in his 70s, for instance.

In the first iteration of the Eastside Hockey Manager, there was a way to "undo" retirements (and set them too), as long as you remembered to ensure you had enough retiring players so that you didn't go over the database's limit. I'd love to have something similar in FHM, at the very least.

I grant I don't know how easy- or practical- it would be to program such a thing but one of the draws of FHM is how much control over the hockey world you have. The one aspect that's missing (aside from being able to create a professional multi-league tournament) is stopping retirements. Surely something can be worked out so that people like me who'd like the feature can use it in some capacity.

[AdequateRandomGaming]

Originally Posted by Adam B

The stats usually tell a story and looking at a player history can tell you enough. There are some storylines with players moving on to other things though, just as there are for coaches/scouts.

As for McBean - If you're playing a Challenge Recalc is on and he was retired by that point, which is why he retired.

Fair point for recalc, which I didn't know was on for Historical Challenges. IMO that feature should be either an option, or turned off. Somebody that really knows a certain era for a challenge can abuse this by trading players away that are on the verge of retiring for better talent/picks (at least for challenges that span multiple seasons)

As for the rest, you completely missed out on the word "immersion". Of course I can go look at all those things, then compare with real life to see at what age a certain player retired - but I shouldn't have to.

I don't understand the constant need to be utterly defensive when people only bring up quality of life suggestions that would make the game experience arguably better. If it's not possible, you can say so, no harm no foul. Just don't dismiss your customers to 3-4 different hockey databases outside of the game so they can figure out for themselves why a player retired at 25.

Now I know you guys don't like comparisons with OOTPB because they have had many more versions and the engines are different, but would an email like OOTPB generates during the season letting you know of players that are going to retire at the end of the season something that would be possible ? That would allow teams to plan ahead of time in certain situations and use assets to get what they need, since retirement happens on July 1st, which is the date in the year teams have the least amount of assets available due to retirement, contract expiry, etc.

[Adam B]

Originally Posted by Mancandy

It took you seven years to figure out that expansion teams are supposed to participate in the entry draft before their first season, so you have absolutely no room to talk about “realism” in this game.

We shouldn’t have to “look at a player history” to tell us. When Corey Crawford announced his retirement, he didn’t say “look at my stats and history and that’ll tell you why I retired.” He gave us a clear, understandable, relatable reason. When people make suggestions to improve immersion, your response shouldn’t be an immediate dismissible, it should be taking it into consideration, or at least saying that, even if you don’t plan on doing so. And while I’m here, when somebody asks a question like OP did - simple yes or no question - your response shouldn’t be to completely ignore them in favor of jumping down the throat of the first reply because they used a word that got under your skin. It’s not hard to be friendly and engaging with customers(if you can’t do it, that’s fine, customer service isn’t for everybody, but you probably shouldn’t be interacting with customers on behalf of the game if you can’t) and I guarantee this type of behavior drives people away from the board and away from the game.

You are going past the line here, and if you continue, you will lose the ability to post on our forums.

We do listen, a lot actually. First and foremost, I would apologize to Todd because re-reading, I thought his question had been answered. There isn't a way to change it. But I stand by what I said. There are often messages with players stating why they are retiring as well.

The majority did not find what you disagreed with about the Draft and Expansion draft dates to be a big deal. The thing we've gotten asked about most this year? Why we moved the draft.

You are reading too much into a post and trying to create conflict where there is none.

Originally Posted by Danielg342

Players also come out of retirement from time to time. I know he's not a hockey player but Jason Witten did.

Here's the thing. Sometimes there's a player I like and I'd like to keep him around. Yeah, it's not "realistic" but some of us don't want to play with absolute 100% realism. We'd still like to see if Wayne Gretzky can produce as a hockey player in his 70s, for instance.

In the first iteration of the Eastside Hockey Manager, there was a way to "undo" retirements (and set them too), as long as you remembered to ensure you had enough retiring players so that you didn't go over the database's limit. I'd love to have something similar in FHM, at the very least.

I grant I don't know how easy- or practical- it would be to program such a thing but one of the draws of FHM is how much control over the hockey world you have. The one aspect that's missing (aside from being able to create a professional multi-league tournament) is stopping retirements. Surely something can be worked out so that people like me who'd like the feature can use it in some capacity.

The only player I can recall who was retired and came back in the last 25 years was Mike Fisher. I'm not saying there isn't more, but I can't think of any (Justin Williams never actually retired).

I understand your point as well, but our database is significantly different than OOTP or any other product. Unretiring isn't possible. The closest thing to do would be import the player back, age him a year and put him on a 3 or 4 year contract. As I stated earlier, 1 or 2 year deals won't keep someone. You could also mess with development age. Someone had some fun results on Reddit.

Originally Posted by AdequateRandomGaming

Fair point for recalc, which I didn't know was on for Historical Challenges. IMO that feature should be either an option, or turned off. Somebody that really knows a certain era for a challenge can abuse this by trading players away that are on the verge of retiring for better talent/picks (at least for challenges that span multiple seasons)

As for the rest, you completely missed out on the word "immersion". Of course I can go look at all those things, then compare with real life to see at what age a certain player retired - but I shouldn't have to.

I don't understand the constant need to be utterly defensive when people only bring up quality of life suggestions that would make the game experience arguably better. If it's not possible, you can say so, no harm no foul. Just don't dismiss your customers to 3-4 different hockey databases outside of the game so they can figure out for themselves why a player retired at 25.

Now I know you guys don't like comparisons with OOTPB because they have had many more versions and the engines are different, but would an email like OOTPB generates during the season letting you know of players that are going to retire at the end of the season something that would be possible ? That would allow teams to plan ahead of time in certain situations and use assets to get what they need, since retirement happens on July 1st, which is the date in the year teams have the least amount of assets available due to retirement, contract expiry, etc.

Recalc was put on for Challenges to give consistency. Yes, you could cheat, but you could cheat more easily with Commissioner Mode and editing tools on. Nothing is quite foolproof. It's not so much about going to other places, but more people using the previous knowledge. It's hard to set something because no matter what we could do someone's going to be less than satisfied.

Also the truth about the comparisons; it's not that we don't like them. It's more about us emphasizing we are different teams, different engines and different development. When people say why can't you just steal x from OOTP, it's having to explain that fact over and over again that can get repetitive.

As for the other, I'm not sure! But I'll pass it along. The reason why retirements happen on July 1st is the database changing over and it's the only functional day that makes sense. Ideally in some far off future version, retirements will happen sporadically but that's probably a dream for the foreseeable future.

There is nothing wrong with offering constructive criticism. There is nothing wrong with having a debate. My job is to try and explain things to both the community and to the developers. It's not always easy both ways. I understand the frustration of seeing a player you like retire, but that's why I gave that background. Age is important. Contract status is important. How are players development is trending is important.

I'm going to leave this thread unlocked right now, but keep it civil.

[Lord PichuPal]

The one thing I'll contribute to this is that I like the idea of being forewarned if a guy is announcing his retirement, even if it doesn't take place until July 1st like usual. Or another way of seeing a list of the retired players. I know it doesn't always send stories out for every player, so I make a habit of going through the transaction logs for the previous season to see who retired (at least in my custom game especially, where there's only a couple leagues to check).

Only other thing I could suggest regarding stopping retirements or a hidden attribute for it is maybe the development or aging ones. If their aging stat is higher it usually means they're built to have a longer career. But like Adam pointed out, usually the stats and the player's profile can tell you a story of why they might've retired early. Chief among them "Did they play for anybody last season" or were they performing well if they did play, or even just what their ratings look like. If the guy isn't very good anymore or wasn't playing anywhere, it's more likely they'll just retire, or if they have a low potential and ability then they may not stick around for very long knowing they won't ever make it far (if no other lower leagues take them in either). A lot of things factor into it, but I wouldn't call it unrealistic either; Andrew Luck retired in the NFL in his late 20s, despite being really talented still and capable of playing longer if he wanted, he just lost the desire and motivation. Maybe storylines like that can be added in later, but for now you can try to fill in the gaps for yourself with what information the game does offer.

[treestreetgaming]

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