Transparency color

[statfreak]

Don't know if this has been addressed before, but would it be possible to use a different transparency color in OOTP4?

I like to use a lot of black in my logos and they appear fine on the team pages, but in the free agent/draft screen and the news screen the black is removed from the logos leaving a not so fresh feeling.

Maybe there is a way around this, but short of not using black, I haven't found a good way.

I like what EA used for Madden2002, a very unpleasant R255, G0, B255, purple/violet color.

Thanks.

[origamirazor]

I brought this up before on the old board. I can't remember if it was Steve or Markus who replied, but they seemed sure that my video card was causing true black to be transparent. So, i'm not sure if they're looking at changing that or not.

In the mean time I use R=5 B=5 G=5, this looks black and isn't tabbed as transparent by the game.

[Killebrew]

Here's some older posts on the subject:

<a href="http://www.forumplanet.com/sportplanet/ootp3/topic.asp?fid=3666&tid=461809&p=1#3629875" target="_blank">Subject: RE: I see a red door...........</a>

<a href="http://www.forumplanet.com/sportplanet/ootp3/topic.asp?fid=3660&tid=446419&p=1#3455074" target="_blank">Subject: RE: One quick ?</a>

I think using a different color besides 0,0,0 black as the default transparent color would be a huge help to any users who like editing or creating their own logo's. Hopefully that is not a hard thing to change in v4 .

[Henry]

Remember that black is "exactly" 0,0,0. That means if your graphics program can assign the RGB (red,green,blue) color assignments, all you have to do is reset all your black colors to 1,1,1 (as an example). To the human eye, that's still black, but the program will no longer see it as transparent.

[Khaos]

This is true, but why choose such a common color?
Normaly, bright pink is used, 255-0-255.

This way it is easily seen as to what is transparent when editing or creating an image and importing one that has black doesn't force you to change the color.

[ December 12, 2001: Message edited by: Khaos ]</p>

[Henry]

Can't speak for Markus....

[Killebrew]

[quote]Originally posted by JHW:
<strong>Remember that black is "exactly" 0,0,0. That means if your graphics program can assign the RGB (red,green,blue) color assignments, all you have to do is reset all your black colors to 1,1,1 (as an example). To the human eye, that's still black, but the program will no longer see it as transparent.</strong><hr></blockquote>

That is easier said than done (unless you have some other pointers for PSP or photoshop ). When creating your own game images like logo's it is easy (if you remember in time) to not use 0,0,0 black, but when using outside images it is not so easy. The only workaround I have found to correct these images within the game is to edit the palette for each image I use and change 0,0,0 to 1,0,0, etc., but that is a big job - enough that it has possibly scared some potential OOTP graphics enhancers away. There may be an easier way to correct the images of course, I don't think it's been mentioned though (any further hints are welcome).

[markeschen]

"Sorry - wrong thread"

[ December 12, 2001: Message edited by: markeschen ]</p>

[Henry]

Killebrew,
Actually, yes, I do have a "pointer" In PSP (which is what I use) I open the graphic containing the 0,0,0 color and go to [colors] [adjust] and [levels], then reset the minimum input and output levels from "0" to "1". That replaces all the 0,0,0 pixels with 1,1,1

Was it Bob Villa that said it's easy if you have the right tools ? LOL

[Killebrew]

[quote]Originally posted by JHW:
<strong>Killebrew,
Actually, yes, I do have a "pointer" In PSP (which is what I use) I open the graphic containing the 0,0,0 color and go to [colors] [adjust] and [levels], then reset the minimum input and output levels from "0" to "1". That replaces all the 0,0,0 pixels with 1,1,1

Was it Bob Villa that said it's easy if you have the right tools ? LOL</strong><hr></blockquote>


Thx Joe, I'll try it! In the meantime if the default transparency color can be easily changed in OOTP4 that would solve this issue in the future .

[Henry]

Actually, there's some logic for using 0,0,0 (black). The graphics programs (as I described above) can easily "exclude" either 0,0,0 or 255,255,255 since they are on the extreme limits. If you choose a color in the middle, even if it is "hot pink", the one time you get that color in a pic, then it's a manual effort to remove it.

I agree, chances are it probably would never happen, but it just seemed a reasonable defense based on graphics program capabilities... and besides, a hot pink transparent color would eliminate me using that cute blond icon with the miniskirt ( hummm... then again, if it was transparent...... )

[ December 14, 2001: Message edited by: JHW ]</p>

[Killebrew]

[quote]Originally posted by JHW:
<strong>Actually, there's some logic for using 0,0,0 (black). The graphics programs (as I described above) can easily "exclude" either 0,0,0 or 255,255,255 since they are on the extreme limits. If you choose a color in the middle, even if it is "hot pink", the one time you get that color in a pic, then it's a manual effort to remove it.</strong><hr></blockquote>

I don't understand, as it is now you have to manually edit the colors on almost any new image you want to use in the game (most commonly that would be logo's for most of us). If a rare color (besides black) was used as the transparent color wouldn't that be an improvement? Most games happen to use a gaudy pink as this rare color but I've seen lime green used as well.

[Specs]

PSP's color replacer can easily replace all black with red-black. Make true black the foreground color and then make 1,0,0 the background.

[Killebrew]

[quote]Originally posted by Blind Jerry:
<strong>PSP's color replacer can easily replace all black with red-black. Make true black the foreground color and then make 1,0,0 the background.</strong><hr></blockquote>

I can't find a color replacer func in PSP, but J. Henry's Colors-->Adjust-->Levels workaround is do-able.

[SSG Troyer]

What version of PSP are you using? I've got 5.x and the color replacer has an icon that looks like a square with a right-facing arrow built into it (kinda). I set the brush to 200 square, tolerance to 35 or so, primary color to my 4-4-8 almost-black, secondary color to 0-0-0, and change everything even close to 0-0-0 to 4-4-8 with one click.

[Henry]

I'm using version 7. Each version they reorganize the tools a bit,a nd the method I'm using only takes a few clicks as well.

There's a number of ways if you have a graphics tool, I guess the bigger issue, and the point Killebrew was making: Is there a color VERY unlikely to be used in a graphic that could be transparent? ... then we wouldn't have to do this at all

[ December 16, 2001: Message edited by: JHW ]</p>

[SSG Troyer]

Well, not speaking for anyone, but black does seem to be a common transparent color choice. It's what FPSFB:Pro99 (the "game" that got me into graphics mods and introduced me to PSP) used, and I've seen it in EA and HH as well.

I'm not sure, but it would seem that the transparent color is pallete position 0 in a 256 color pallete. Why that would effect a 32-bit pallete, I have no idea, but it might have something to do with translation.

Now, in FPSFB:Pro99, the tutorial would have you change pallete 0 from 0-0-0 to 255-0-255 to identify potentially transparent pixels, get you to change them to near-black, then change pallete 0 back to 0-0-0. So while I'm sure it would be easier, I suspect we're bumping against an industry standard.

[ December 17, 2001: Message edited by: SSG Troyer ]</p>

[Killebrew]

As far as industry standard is concerned, I am not sure which colors are most common, but the game's that use transparencies which I have edited graphics for used a bright pink or green color. These games include the EA Sports NHL 1996 - 2001 series, SSI's Panzer General 1 & 2, Steel Panthers 1-3, and Silent Hunter 1, and Microprose's Civilization 1 and 2. It doesn't really matter to me which color is used though, as I agree whatever it is can be edited later if needed by the user. As Henry pointed out (thx) I'm just saying maybe there is a better, easier way . I suspect in the case of the Civilization series, the awkward transparent color was chosen to encourage graphics add-ons. In some cases a game designer might also want to discourage graphics add-ons (less end user support required).