PbP question

tannim · 04-02-2003, 01:33 PM

So far, I have played rather than simmed at least 100 games. Here is a partial list of what I have seen so far:

a triple play
several cycles
an inside the park home run
at least one no hitter
a 1-2-3 double play (that is the p -> c ->1b, right)
a 5-3 double play
dropped third strikes where the catcher threw out the batter and where the catcher did not throw out the batter
people thrown out at third trying to stretch a double into a triple and people safe at third in the same situation

Some of the items i have listed since I have read on the board that these events rarely seem to happen. What I have not seen is some one getting thrown out at second trying to stretch a single into a double. It seems that everytime someone trys for the double, he always gets it. Has anyone seen the batter get thrown out at second? It could be my imagination, but this does seem to happen more often than a no-hitter, or a cycle, or an inside the park homerun, or even dropped third strikes.

ctorg · 04-02-2003, 01:47 PM

Cycles seem to happen more often in OOTP, from what I can tell, than in real life. I don't know why. It's not like the rates of extra base hits are off in the game or anything.

I've never seen an inside-the-parker in the game. How was the PBP for it?

rasnell · 04-02-2003, 02:09 PM

I've seen only one inside-the-park HR in about 15 seasons of simming -- and it happened in a World Series.

I've never seen a triple play or the ball bouncing off the head of the outfielder (as some have noted, Canseco-style).

No-hitters have seemed realistic. Cycle does seem a little frequent.

I think pickoffs are way too frequent and we should be able to tell our baserunners to play conservatively when you really need that baserunner.

LAH · 04-02-2003, 02:20 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by rasnell

I think pickoffs are way too frequent and we should be able to tell our baserunners to play conservatively when you really need that baserunner.

New engine.

Gastric ReFlux · 04-02-2003, 02:21 PM

Lots of cycles. The first year I started I had a guy hit for the 6187th cycle in league history.

LAH · 04-02-2003, 02:25 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by tannim
So far, I have played rather than simmed at least 100 games. Here is a partial list of what I have seen so far:
a triple play

several cycles

an inside the park home run

at least one no hitter

a 1-2-3 double play (that is the p -> c ->1b, right)

a 5-3 double play

dropped third strikes where the catcher threw out the batter and where the catcher did not throw out the batter

people thrown out at third trying to stretch a double into a triple and people safe at third in the same situation

Some of the items i have listed since I have read on the board that these events rarely seem to happen. What I have not seen is some one getting thrown out at second trying to stretch a single into a double. It seems that everytime someone trys for the double, he always gets it. Has anyone seen the batter get thrown out at second? It could be my imagination, but this does seem to happen more often than a no-hitter, or a cycle, or an inside the park homerun, or even dropped third strikes.

That is funny, I was thinking the same thing about getting thrown out at second trying to stretch a single into a double.

This comes down to something that dissappointed me with OOTP5, and that is the PbP. It is virtually identical to OOTP4 in every way (including the rain delay bug

). I would have liked to have seen more variation, reading the exact same description of a pop-foul behind home plate gets boring. I think that more effort should have been put into adding some variation to the PbP text.

It could actually go a long way to making OOTP5 "feel better" (for lack of a better phrase)

Also, it sounds a little odd when an outfielder is racing to the wall to catch a deeply hit ball, then it says he catches it at his shoetops.

Dazooz · 04-02-2003, 02:26 PM

I get about 2 catcher's interference calls a season.

Several hit balls bounced off of the pitcher to an in-fielder and then thrown out.

I still feel that the number of runners thrown out when stealing attempts is a bit off. Too many "C" arm rated catchers with 50% thrown out percentages.

Gastric ReFlux · 04-02-2003, 02:27 PM

I'd like to see some PbP that says, "Johnson crosses home, then runs over the bat boy."

GuruB · 04-02-2003, 04:09 PM

Or maybe... Snow crosses homeplate, and picks up batboy?

Gastric ReFlux · 04-02-2003, 05:08 PM

Quote:

maybe... Snow crosses homeplate, and picks up batboy?

that's the optimistic humanitarian view. me? I'm looking for players going full tilt, bat boys be damned.

Kelric · 04-02-2003, 05:11 PM

I have played and simmed many, many seasons and have yet to see a triple play or an inside the park homer, or a Canseco style screw up. Have been a part of several No-Hitters, simmed a few perfect games.....

tategter · 04-02-2003, 05:56 PM

Has anyone else ever gotten the "runner is thrown-out at second trying to stretch a double into a triple" play in the PbP? Gotten that one twice in about 100 games.

I always thought it should say something like "the throw from 'outfielder' beats the runner to 3rd and 'baserunner' is caught in no-man's land. 'baserunner' hits the brakes and dives back to 2nd only to be tagged out by '2nd basemen'."

Just doesn't sound right when the guy is out at second on a failed stretched double.

:edited to correct mistake of using <> symbols

SSG Troyer · 04-03-2003, 11:10 AM

I have seen a single-into-a-double turn into an out. Twice, I think, in over 1620 games played. I have yet to see a triple play.

One thing that ticks me off is the error rate for sac-fly throws. You know, a deep fly ball that would have been a sac fly, but the throw home is wild. Error charged to outfielder, no sac fly awarded, run scores, runners advance. I get as many, if not more, of these than I get sac flies.

And I haven't seen a 2nd/3rd run-down like tategter describes ... I thought run-downs of any kind weren't in the game at all.....pity. One of the great baseball plays -- runner on second, less than two out. Batter singles. Runner rounds third, but stops as throw home is cut off. Batter, seeing throw home, goes to second, but is caught between bases by the cutoff. A run-down ensues, where the defense must pay attention to the runner at third. Will he score? Will they get the gimme out at 1st/2nd? Or will the batter go for 2nd, and the runner break for the plate as 1B throws to 2B, who relays to C without trying the tag, and everybody's safe (or runner out at home in collision)? -- is totally absent.

Mind you, I understand why

THAT PbP would be a bear to program ... and a bear to read at Very Fast.

Eugene Church · 04-03-2003, 06:26 PM

It sure would be nice if the PBP had more variety.
I have played OOTP3 and OOTP4...will get OOTP5 after the next patch.

Sometimes I get the feeling OOTPB is designed primarily for simmers. There are many normal, everyday plays that never happen or happen very infrequently...here is my list:

no dropped throws...no dropped infield flies...no dropped IF and OF foul flies...Catcher never drops a flyball...LF, RF, 2B, SS never catch foul flies...only C, 3B and 1B catch them...very few double plays involving catchers at homeplate (1-2-3...5-2-3...6-2-3...3-2-3, etc.) In MLB catchers have about 5-15 DP's per season...OOTPB only 1-5 per season...no double plays on strikeouts...never seen an out at second trying to stretch a single...never seen inside the park homer (some have seen it)...no out at home stretching a triple.

Steve said OOTP5 play-by-play has been enhanced. I hope it includes some of the above basic plays. This would make a great game even better...and more interesting to play...by...play.

Bill Broadhurst · 04-03-2003, 06:50 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Eugene Church
It sure would be nice if the PBP had more variety.
I have played OOTP3 and OOTP4...will get OOTP5 after the next patch.

Sometimes I get the feeling OOTPB is designed primarily for simmers. There are many normal, everyday plays that never happen or happen very infrequently...here is my list:

no dropped throws...no dropped infield flies...no dropped IF and OF foul flies...Catcher never drops a flyball...LF, RF, 2B, SS never catch foul flies...only C, 3B and 1B catch them...very few double plays involving catchers at homeplate (1-2-3...5-2-3...6-2-3...3-2-3, etc.) In MLB catchers have about 5-15 DP's per season...OOTPB only 1-5 per season...no double plays on strikeouts...never seen an out at second trying to stretch a single...never seen inside the park homer (some have seen it)...no out at home stretching a triple.

Steve said OOTP5 play-by-play has been enhanced. I hope it includes some of the above basic plays. This would make a great game even better...and more interesting to play...by...play.

Couldn't have said it better...if these are in there, I've never seen them. And I know they can be programmed, because Baseball for Windows had all of them and more (steals of home, anyone??)--and sometimes it made for quite an exciting game. Just my two cents.

Bill

Quinn · 04-03-2003, 06:52 PM

I had a guy hit an inside the park homer against me in the 4th game I played in OOTP5...basically, outfielder dove for the ball and missed...rolled ALL the way to the wall...

well, you already know the ending...

LAH · 04-04-2003, 10:49 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Eugene Church

Sometimes I get the feeling OOTPB is designed primarily for simmers. There are many normal, everyday plays that never happen or happen very infrequently...here is my list:

I get the same feeling and it sucks!

Quote:

no dropped throws...no dropped infield flies...no dropped IF and OF foul flies...Catcher never drops a flyball...LF, RF, 2B, SS never catch foul flies...only C, 3B and 1B catch them...very few double plays involving catchers at homeplate (1-2-3...5-2-3...6-2-3...3-2-3, etc.) In MLB catchers have about 5-15 DP's per season...OOTPB only 1-5 per season...no double plays on strikeouts...never seen an out at second trying to stretch a single...never seen inside the park homer (some have seen it)...no out at home stretching a triple.

Steve said OOTP5 play-by-play has been enhanced. I hope it includes some of the above basic plays. This would make a great game even better...and more interesting to play...by...play.

If OOTP5's PbP has been enhanced, then I did not notice.

I still think the OOTP series need a major overhaul, especially to its baseball game system.

I mean, its cute that you can play manager mode and get married and have children, but this should have been done after we had a more solid game of baseball to play...

MHO, but I will not fund OOTP any more until they fix some of these in game issues, and I would hope that OOTP's customers demand more from them than what we got in v5...

Once again, MHO...

Antonin · 04-04-2003, 03:21 PM

One thing that bothered me a little in STB2k3 and has continued in OOTP5 is that outfielders never even try to get the runner out by throwing to the cutoff guy or throwing directly to the guy covering the base.

This is a minor thing, though.

Some of the p-b-p things people call unrealistic actually do happen in RL. Just watching the Cleveland Indians over the last ten-fifteen years, things like back-to-back-to-back-to-back home runs, three or four passed balls in a row, incredible rallies in the bottom of the ninth with two outs, outfielders who just stand there and let the ball drop two feet in front of them...well, for us in Cleveland, that's just baseball. So I have fewer complaints about the game engine than most.

To me, the pbp is close enough to real baseball to be satisfying. Just my 2 centavos.

ctorg · 04-04-2003, 03:29 PM

One thing I've seen happen plenty of times in OOTP4 that I'd like not to see happen very often (since it would be a real mental lapse if a guy did this):

Bases loaded, no outs, bottom of the ninth, tie score. Batter hits a groundball to infielder. Infielder picks it up and throws to first, retiring the runner, but the winning run scores, game over.

Perhaps this is fixed in OOTP5, but I don't play games out anymore because I can't stand the PBP.

Steve Kuffrey · 04-04-2003, 03:29 PM

Just for those who are curious, yes the pbp was enhanced this year and yes it would be great to include every posible play, etc...comparisons to a game that has been around since the 1950's (APBA/BBW) aren't quite fair IMO. OOTP has been out 5 years.....I wonder what the pbp was like for APBA in year 5?

Just my .02......and wanting the game to grow and get better "even more than you guys", but realizing that it takes time and I need to be patient.

04-02-2003, 01:33 PM	#1
tannim Bat Boy Join Date: Mar 2003 Posts: 10	PbP question So far, I have played rather than simmed at least 100 games. Here is a partial list of what I have seen so far: a triple play several cycles an inside the park home run at least one no hitter a 1-2-3 double play (that is the p -> c ->1b, right) a 5-3 double play dropped third strikes where the catcher threw out the batter and where the catcher did not throw out the batter people thrown out at third trying to stretch a double into a triple and people safe at third in the same situation Some of the items i have listed since I have read on the board that these events rarely seem to happen. What I have not seen is some one getting thrown out at second trying to stretch a single into a double. It seems that everytime someone trys for the double, he always gets it. Has anyone seen the batter get thrown out at second? It could be my imagination, but this does seem to happen more often than a no-hitter, or a cycle, or an inside the park homerun, or even dropped third strikes.

04-02-2003, 01:47 PM	#2
ctorg Global Moderator Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: Queens, NY Posts: 9,848	Cycles seem to happen more often in OOTP, from what I can tell, than in real life. I don't know why. It's not like the rates of extra base hits are off in the game or anything. I've never seen an inside-the-parker in the game. How was the PBP for it? __________________ My music "When the trees blow back and forth, that's what makes the wind." - Steven Wright Fjord emena pancreas thorax fornicate marmalade morpheme proteolysis smaxa cabana offal srue vitriol grope hallelujah lentils

04-02-2003, 02:09 PM	#3
rasnell Hall Of Famer Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: Frankfort, Kentucky Posts: 3,746	I've seen only one inside-the-park HR in about 15 seasons of simming -- and it happened in a World Series. I've never seen a triple play or the ball bouncing off the head of the outfielder (as some have noted, Canseco-style). No-hitters have seemed realistic. Cycle does seem a little frequent. I think pickoffs are way too frequent and we should be able to tell our baserunners to play conservatively when you really need that baserunner. __________________ Charlie Root won more games for the Cubs than any pitcher (201), yet was remembered for one pitch to Babe Ruth. Find out more about the 1929 World Series in my book, "Root for the Cubs: Charlie Root and the 1929 Chicago Cubs." See the web site at www.rootforthecubs.com. The book is at http://www.amazon.com/Root-Cubs-Char...t+for+the+cubs. Beta tester, OOTP 2007-2023 and iOOTP 2011-2014.

04-03-2003, 11:10 AM	#13
SSG Troyer All Star Starter Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: Somewhere to the left of 2nd base Posts: 1,598	I have seen a single-into-a-double turn into an out. Twice, I think, in over 1620 games played. I have yet to see a triple play. One thing that ticks me off is the error rate for sac-fly throws. You know, a deep fly ball that would have been a sac fly, but the throw home is wild. Error charged to outfielder, no sac fly awarded, run scores, runners advance. I get as many, if not more, of these than I get sac flies. And I haven't seen a 2nd/3rd run-down like tategter describes ... I thought run-downs of any kind weren't in the game at all.....pity. One of the great baseball plays -- runner on second, less than two out. Batter singles. Runner rounds third, but stops as throw home is cut off. Batter, seeing throw home, goes to second, but is caught between bases by the cutoff. A run-down ensues, where the defense must pay attention to the runner at third. Will he score? Will they get the gimme out at 1st/2nd? Or will the batter go for 2nd, and the runner break for the plate as 1B throws to 2B, who relays to C without trying the tag, and everybody's safe (or runner out at home in collision)? -- is totally absent. Mind you, I understand why THAT PbP would be a bear to program ... and a bear to read at Very Fast. __________________ MWT Did Tennesee Delaware Mississppi's New Jersey? Idaho ... Alaska!

04-03-2003, 06:52 PM	#16
Quinn Bat Boy Join Date: Mar 2003 Posts: 15	I had a guy hit an inside the park homer against me in the 4th game I played in OOTP5...basically, outfielder dove for the ball and missed...rolled ALL the way to the wall... well, you already know the ending... __________________ <font color= "00ff00" >•</font><font color= "33ff33" >Q</font><font color= "00ff33" >u</font><font color= "66ff66" >i</font><font color= "99ff99" >n</font><font color= "ccffcc" >n</font>

04-02-2003, 02:21 PM	#5
Gastric ReFlux Hall Of Famer Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: Member #3409 Posts: 8,350	Lots of cycles. The first year I started I had a guy hit for the 6187th cycle in league history.

04-02-2003, 02:26 PM	#7
Dazooz Minors (Double A) Join Date: Dec 2001 Posts: 193	I get about 2 catcher's interference calls a season. Several hit balls bounced off of the pitcher to an in-fielder and then thrown out. I still feel that the number of runners thrown out when stealing attempts is a bit off. Too many "C" arm rated catchers with 50% thrown out percentages.

04-02-2003, 02:27 PM	#8
Gastric ReFlux Hall Of Famer Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: Member #3409 Posts: 8,350	I'd like to see some PbP that says, "Johnson crosses home, then runs over the bat boy."

04-02-2003, 04:09 PM	#9
GuruB Minors (Single A) Join Date: Feb 2002 Location: Tucson, AZ Posts: 65	Or maybe... Snow crosses homeplate, and picks up batboy?

04-02-2003, 05:11 PM	#11
Kelric Hall Of Famer Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Greater Boston Area Posts: 3,992	I have played and simmed many, many seasons and have yet to see a triple play or an inside the park homer, or a Canseco style screw up. Have been a part of several No-Hitters, simmed a few perfect games.....

04-02-2003, 05:56 PM	#12
tategter Minors (Single A) Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: Florida Posts: 67	Has anyone else ever gotten the "runner is thrown-out at second trying to stretch a double into a triple" play in the PbP? Gotten that one twice in about 100 games. I always thought it should say something like "the throw from 'outfielder' beats the runner to 3rd and 'baserunner' is caught in no-man's land. 'baserunner' hits the brakes and dives back to 2nd only to be tagged out by '2nd basemen'." Just doesn't sound right when the guy is out at second on a failed stretched double. :edited to correct mistake of using <> symbols

04-03-2003, 06:26 PM	#14
Eugene Church Hall Of Famer Join Date: Aug 2002 Posts: 36,075	It sure would be nice if the PBP had more variety. I have played OOTP3 and OOTP4...will get OOTP5 after the next patch. Sometimes I get the feeling OOTPB is designed primarily for simmers. There are many normal, everyday plays that never happen or happen very infrequently...here is my list: no dropped throws...no dropped infield flies...no dropped IF and OF foul flies...Catcher never drops a flyball...LF, RF, 2B, SS never catch foul flies...only C, 3B and 1B catch them...very few double plays involving catchers at homeplate (1-2-3...5-2-3...6-2-3...3-2-3, etc.) In MLB catchers have about 5-15 DP's per season...OOTPB only 1-5 per season...no double plays on strikeouts...never seen an out at second trying to stretch a single...never seen inside the park homer (some have seen it)...no out at home stretching a triple. Steve said OOTP5 play-by-play has been enhanced. I hope it includes some of the above basic plays. This would make a great game even better...and more interesting to play...by...play.

04-04-2003, 03:21 PM	#18
Antonin Hall Of Famer Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: Ohio Posts: 2,539	One thing that bothered me a little in STB2k3 and has continued in OOTP5 is that outfielders never even try to get the runner out by throwing to the cutoff guy or throwing directly to the guy covering the base. This is a minor thing, though. Some of the p-b-p things people call unrealistic actually do happen in RL. Just watching the Cleveland Indians over the last ten-fifteen years, things like back-to-back-to-back-to-back home runs, three or four passed balls in a row, incredible rallies in the bottom of the ninth with two outs, outfielders who just stand there and let the ball drop two feet in front of them...well, for us in Cleveland, that's just baseball. So I have fewer complaints about the game engine than most. To me, the pbp is close enough to real baseball to be satisfying. Just my 2 centavos.

04-04-2003, 03:29 PM	#19
ctorg Global Moderator Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: Queens, NY Posts: 9,848	One thing I've seen happen plenty of times in OOTP4 that I'd like not to see happen very often (since it would be a real mental lapse if a guy did this): Bases loaded, no outs, bottom of the ninth, tie score. Batter hits a groundball to infielder. Infielder picks it up and throws to first, retiring the runner, but the winning run scores, game over. Perhaps this is fixed in OOTP5, but I don't play games out anymore because I can't stand the PBP. __________________ My music "When the trees blow back and forth, that's what makes the wind." - Steven Wright Fjord emena pancreas thorax fornicate marmalade morpheme proteolysis smaxa cabana offal srue vitriol grope hallelujah lentils

04-04-2003, 03:29 PM	#20
Steve Kuffrey Administrator Join Date: Jul 1999 Location: S.E. TN - Georgia born and raised Posts: 17,023	Just for those who are curious, yes the pbp was enhanced this year and yes it would be great to include every posible play, etc...comparisons to a game that has been around since the 1950's (APBA/BBW) aren't quite fair IMO. OOTP has been out 5 years.....I wonder what the pbp was like for APBA in year 5? Just my .02......and wanting the game to grow and get better "even more than you guys", but realizing that it takes time and I need to be patient. __________________ Steve Kuffrey DABS Atlanta Braves - 2008 Eastern Division Champ *DBLC Atlanta Braves - 2011, 2014 East Division Champ, 2012, 2013 NL Wildcard Baseball Maelstrom-Montreal Expos-2013 Tourney winner, 2014 WC Team Sparky's League - Tampa Bay D'Rays Epicenter Baseball League - Astros 2014 The CBL Rewind - Phillies '95