Still Don't Understand Scouting

PSUColonel · 04-14-2013, 05:13 PM

Here is the same thing in v14 that was discussed in this prior thread:

http://www.ootpdevelopments.com/boar...take-note.html

Tycobbler · 04-14-2013, 05:18 PM

Your scouts glance at the player at this time vs. the OSA opinion?

Neolithic · 04-14-2013, 05:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tycobbler

Your scouts glance at the player at this time vs. the OSA opinion?

His own scout thinks he a 1 out of 3 star on the profile page, and a half star out of 4 star in the scouting report page.

olivertheorem · 04-14-2013, 05:19 PM

All I can think of is that the second screen is carrying the OSA stars all the way down when it shouldn't.

nebradska · 04-14-2013, 06:47 PM

In 13, where OSA scouting does not use stars, this still happens.

PSUColonel · 04-15-2013, 12:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Neolithic

His own scout thinks he a 1 out of 3 star on the profile page, and a half star out of 4 star in the scouting report page.

exactly...Markus said this would no longer be an issue due to the re-design of the scouting system...am I missing something?

Centre · 04-15-2013, 11:17 PM

Anyone have an answer? This was probably my least favorite part of OOTP13 and I'm sad to see it here too (I'm loving the game otherwise so far, don't you worry).

It's gotten to the point where I can never trust the ratings on a player's profile screen, because it's inevitable that a 4 or 5 star player is actually a 1.5/2 player on the actual scouting report page.

PSUColonel · 04-16-2013, 10:32 AM

Markus....can you please explain what's going on here?

Markus Heinsohn · 04-16-2013, 10:45 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PSUColonel

Markus....can you please explain what's going on here?

No. Not without knowing your settings and having a look at your league files. Please post about this in the bug reports forum and upload the league files and mention the name of the file in the post.

This did not happen during beta, I can tell you that much. Not sure what is going on, unless between the scouting report and the visit of the screen something happened to the league. What you see on the profile screen is always calculated with the scouted ratings in relation to league average at that moment, while the scouting report in the history has the league average saved at the time of the report filing, that's why there may be a difference. Also, current position / role is a factor as well, and if that changes, the star ratings will differ too.

Edit: Upon further checking your screenshots, the reason could be that the roster shuffling taking place that day has led to a change of league averages after the original report was filed, since it is a day before season start.
Edit2: Do you have the option "Overall ratings based on AI evaluation" checked? That may be a reason too.

MizzouRah · 04-16-2013, 11:09 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Markus Heinsohn

No. Not without knowing your settings and having a look at your league files. Please post about this in the bug reports forum and upload the league files and mention the name of the file in the post.

This did not happen during beta, I can tell you that much. Not sure what is going on, unless between the scouting report and the visit of the screen something happened to the league. What you see on the profile screen is always calculated with the scouted ratings in relation to league average at that moment, while the scouting report in the history has the league average saved at the time of the report filing, that's why there may be a difference. Also, current position / role is a factor as well, and if that changes, the star ratings will differ too.

Edit: Upon further checking your screenshots, the reason could be that the roster shuffling taking place that day has led to a change of league averages after the original report was filed, since it is a day before season start.
Edit2: Do you have the option "Overall ratings based on AI evaluation" checked? That may be a reason too.

I bet he does as so do I. We spoke about that setting a few months back in the v13 forum.

That causes fluctuations in those two screens?

SirMichaelJordan · 04-16-2013, 01:18 PM

I have AI Evaluation on and have been noticing this too.

And when I click on apply changes now, I get different ratings for a player each click. And that is with having scouting off. Its as if the ratings are not 100% accurate.

Does the AI make roster moves every time the apply changes now button is clicked?

If so, everything makes sense now.

MizzouRah · 04-16-2013, 02:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SirMichaelJordan

I have AI Evaluation on and have been noticing this too.

And when I click on apply changes now, I get different ratings for a player each click. And that is with having scouting off. Its as if the ratings are not 100% accurate.

Does the AI make roster moves every time the apply changes now button is clicked?

If so, everything makes sense now.

If you change those eval settings they might.

SirMichaelJordan · 04-16-2013, 02:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MizzouRah

If you change those eval settings they might.

I should mention that I click on the button multiple times without changing the percentages around.

So if I have 40/30/20/10 and I click on apply changes now, I would get about 4 different ratings for a player each click before its stays at a static number.

Idk, maybe the AI is making moves with each click hence the number staying the same after a few clicks. I may try with OVR based on players not positions. Its really weird to see a player have a 20 OVR then next thing you know he's a 40 after looking at a different screen.

Neolithic · 04-16-2013, 03:49 PM

I've always had both those options checked in the League Setup. I can't figure out the right way to explain why I do that, but I do. :P

A quote from someone important during a broadcast once (I wanna say a GM or manager or something along those lines) was "If you can hit (eval as a DH, which is what OOTP does when you have it done not by position) we'll find a place for you to play defense, even if you can't field at all."

Personally, I'd like a setup screen to make Evaluation comparison groups, and just give me free control to decide what positions are included in it for the AI to do it's evaluations. Or I'm just crazy, dumb, or something, and it should be the way it is... :P

Now I have to get back to my OOTP, I'm foamin at the mouth here!!

PSUColonel · 04-17-2013, 03:04 PM

I have both checked, but I'm not sure why it would/should make a difference??

PSUColonel · 04-26-2013, 12:54 PM

Are other people still noticing this? I am still experiencing this, and can't figure it out. For me, it is happening regardless of what settings I use. (I have used just about every combination)

EDIT: my suggestion to Markus is to eliminate the profile page star ratings, and only use the snapshot in time overall rating used within the scouting report. To me this would solve the problem, and cut out what I consider to be a cheat. The cheat being that you always know what your scout currently thinks via the profile page.

SirMichaelJordan · 04-26-2013, 01:17 PM

Same..

hefalumps · 04-26-2013, 02:26 PM

I'm sad to see this still in 14. I haven't started a new league yet to see it for myself, but in 13 I had this problem quite a bit, and the differences between profile and scout page were especially large for relief pitchers.

Here's my post from a similar thread in the OOTP13 forum:

http://www.ootpdevelopments.com/boar...ml#post3463631

So is he a four-star reliever or a one-star reliever? The actual numbers match between the profile and scouting report, but the overall/potential is in complete disagreement. It's this way with a bunch of MRs in my league; I always have to check the actual scouting report and try to average out the two or base my eval on the individual attribute ratings. That's not a problem for me, but it begs the question - why have the overall/potential ratings at all if you can't rely on them as an accurate "summary" of the player's ability?

I'd love to know what's going on. I too have played with the different AI evaluation settings and haven't been able to make sense of it.

PSUColonel · 04-26-2013, 02:49 PM

T me, I think this is the solution. From what I can tell the profile page ratings are based on the AI's overall evaluation of the player. The scouting report is a time based report. I still want the AI to have the opinion based on evaluation and not ratings, so why not just give us the option to hide the overall rating on the profile page,(stars) while allowing the ability to view stars on the scouting page? It would also be nice though if you could view the scouted overall rating (again, stars) on other pages such as the lineup screen or anywhere else, instead of the the way it currently is...which show the profile page rating.

PSUColonel · 05-14-2013, 02:32 AM

I don't like to get impatient or angry, but this has been completely ignored even though it was said this would no longer be an issue. It is not as though it is something that is only happening to me...in fact it is very common, and it doesn't appear anything has been changed at all. Is this something I should just give up on at this point? Markus stated this would no longer happen prior to release, so I can't understand how this is still happening...unless he just does't want to change it for whatever reason.

04-14-2013, 05:13 PM	#1
PSUColonel Hall Of Famer Join Date: Feb 2002 Posts: 13,141	Still Don't Understand Scouting Here is the same thing in v14 that was discussed in this prior thread: http://www.ootpdevelopments.com/boar...take-note.html Attached Images

04-16-2013, 01:18 PM	#11
SirMichaelJordan Hall Of Famer Join Date: Apr 2012 Posts: 2,716	Still Don't Understand Scouting I have AI Evaluation on and have been noticing this too. And when I click on apply changes now, I get different ratings for a player each click. And that is with having scouting off. Its as if the ratings are not 100% accurate. Does the AI make roster moves every time the apply changes now button is clicked? If so, everything makes sense now. Last edited by SirMichaelJordan; 04-16-2013 at 01:22 PM.

04-26-2013, 12:54 PM	#16
PSUColonel Hall Of Famer Join Date: Feb 2002 Posts: 13,141	Are other people still noticing this? I am still experiencing this, and can't figure it out. For me, it is happening regardless of what settings I use. (I have used just about every combination) EDIT: my suggestion to Markus is to eliminate the profile page star ratings, and only use the snapshot in time overall rating used within the scouting report. To me this would solve the problem, and cut out what I consider to be a cheat. The cheat being that you always know what your scout currently thinks via the profile page. Last edited by PSUColonel; 04-26-2013 at 12:57 PM.

04-14-2013, 05:18 PM	#2
Tycobbler Hall Of Famer Join Date: Apr 2003 Location: 20 minutes from Comerica Park Posts: 2,015	Your scouts glance at the player at this time vs. the OSA opinion?

04-14-2013, 05:19 PM	#4
olivertheorem All Star Starter Join Date: Jun 2006 Posts: 1,919	All I can think of is that the second screen is carrying the OSA stars all the way down when it shouldn't.

04-14-2013, 06:47 PM	#5
nebradska Minors (Triple A) Join Date: Apr 2012 Location: Illinois Posts: 229	In 13, where OSA scouting does not use stars, this still happens.

04-15-2013, 11:17 PM	#7
Centre Minors (Rookie Ball) Join Date: Jun 2011 Location: Washington, DC Posts: 27	Anyone have an answer? This was probably my least favorite part of OOTP13 and I'm sad to see it here too (I'm loving the game otherwise so far, don't you worry). It's gotten to the point where I can never trust the ratings on a player's profile screen, because it's inevitable that a 4 or 5 star player is actually a 1.5/2 player on the actual scouting report page.

04-16-2013, 10:32 AM	#8
PSUColonel Hall Of Famer Join Date: Feb 2002 Posts: 13,141	Markus....can you please explain what's going on here?

04-16-2013, 03:49 PM	#14
Neolithic Minors (Double A) Join Date: Jan 2004 Posts: 110	I've always had both those options checked in the League Setup. I can't figure out the right way to explain why I do that, but I do. :P A quote from someone important during a broadcast once (I wanna say a GM or manager or something along those lines) was "If you can hit (eval as a DH, which is what OOTP does when you have it done not by position) we'll find a place for you to play defense, even if you can't field at all." Personally, I'd like a setup screen to make Evaluation comparison groups, and just give me free control to decide what positions are included in it for the AI to do it's evaluations. Or I'm just crazy, dumb, or something, and it should be the way it is... :P Now I have to get back to my OOTP, I'm foamin at the mouth here!!

04-17-2013, 03:04 PM	#15
PSUColonel Hall Of Famer Join Date: Feb 2002 Posts: 13,141	I have both checked, but I'm not sure why it would/should make a difference??

04-26-2013, 01:17 PM	#17
SirMichaelJordan Hall Of Famer Join Date: Apr 2012 Posts: 2,716	Same..

04-26-2013, 02:26 PM	#18
hefalumps All Star Starter Join Date: Mar 2003 Posts: 1,392	I'm sad to see this still in 14. I haven't started a new league yet to see it for myself, but in 13 I had this problem quite a bit, and the differences between profile and scout page were especially large for relief pitchers. Here's my post from a similar thread in the OOTP13 forum: http://www.ootpdevelopments.com/boar...ml#post3463631 So is he a four-star reliever or a one-star reliever? The actual numbers match between the profile and scouting report, but the overall/potential is in complete disagreement. It's this way with a bunch of MRs in my league; I always have to check the actual scouting report and try to average out the two or base my eval on the individual attribute ratings. That's not a problem for me, but it begs the question - why have the overall/potential ratings at all if you can't rely on them as an accurate "summary" of the player's ability? I'd love to know what's going on. I too have played with the different AI evaluation settings and haven't been able to make sense of it.

04-26-2013, 02:49 PM	#19
PSUColonel Hall Of Famer Join Date: Feb 2002 Posts: 13,141	T me, I think this is the solution. From what I can tell the profile page ratings are based on the AI's overall evaluation of the player. The scouting report is a time based report. I still want the AI to have the opinion based on evaluation and not ratings, so why not just give us the option to hide the overall rating on the profile page,(stars) while allowing the ability to view stars on the scouting page? It would also be nice though if you could view the scouted overall rating (again, stars) on other pages such as the lineup screen or anywhere else, instead of the the way it currently is...which show the profile page rating.

05-14-2013, 02:32 AM	#20
PSUColonel Hall Of Famer Join Date: Feb 2002 Posts: 13,141	I don't like to get impatient or angry, but this has been completely ignored even though it was said this would no longer be an issue. It is not as though it is something that is only happening to me...in fact it is very common, and it doesn't appear anything has been changed at all. Is this something I should just give up on at this point? Markus stated this would no longer happen prior to release, so I can't understand how this is still happening...unless he just does't want to change it for whatever reason.