Jays sign Mike Bordick... Whoopee doo!

JAttractive · 12-20-2002, 05:35 PM

http://waymoresports.thestar.com/NAS...path=Home/Home

1 million for a 37 year old back-up infielder who hit .232 last season.

Ok he is great defensively and I understand the need to have veteran's and such but moves like this just bother me. It just seems like a complete waste of 1 million dollars when the Jays will turn around and go cheap on a player and fail to sign/re-sign them or fail to add a solid regular or starting pitcher. I know a million dollars doesn't seem like much anymore but the Jays will turn around and not sign a more useful guy over even smaller differences in salary.

Take for instance Kevin Millwood. The Braves basically gave him up for free and probably would have taken less than the Phillies offered just to get him out of the division. He is expected to make 10 million in arbitration this season and while that is a far cry from 1 million if you cut out enough of these types of signings you could have taken him or at least a player in a similar circumstance that a team is looking to unload... or maybe they could have kept a guy like Chris Carpenter or Mike Sirotka and pray they return to form in a year. They would be bargains for their salary if they did and not overly costly gambles if they fail and yet they lose them over a few hundred thousand dollars difference.

I just hate that you know what you are getting with a guy like Bordick already which isn't much and he will probably only play in a very limited number of games to boot. At the same time for his salary you could take some gambles on guys or use the money somewhere more important.

I still like J.P. but these are the types of moves that irritate me.

JAttractive · 12-20-2002, 05:39 PM

Ok maybe saving 1 million is still a bit of a stretch in bringing in Kevin Millwood but my point is that there are probably other players in Millwood's situation that teams are looking to unload as well. Yet there are always back up infielders lieing around at the start of the season that can be picked up for the league minimum and probably wouldn't make much difference over Bordick for the amount they play... that is my point.

crackpott · 12-20-2002, 06:08 PM

No way Millwood gets 10M in arbitration, but anyway...

I'm kinda glad we got Bordick. 1M isn't unreasonable, and it's nice to have some insurance around for when Woodward fails seeing as Lopez is gone.

JAttractive · 12-20-2002, 06:38 PM

Yeah I just used the 10 million figure because that is what the ESPN article said. I really have no idea.

I also agree that Woodward's season last year was a fluke and while I also agree having Bordick around is nice insurance I don't like to see them throw even a million dollars around at this point in things when they still have some glaring holes. Maybe J.P. already has plans in the works for those though so I may be jumping the gun a bit here but I really think they could have waited to sign a back-up infielder in case that money is useful later.

Apparently a million dollars is suddenly worth something again (based on some of the recent moves teams have made).

crackpott · 12-22-2002, 01:34 PM

if that was bad note that we just gave 1 million to Tanyon Sturtze.

JAttractive · 12-22-2002, 02:10 PM

Maybe I am too much of a gambler-type but I actually don't mind this deal. I figure the Jays are not exactly favourites to contend next season but if they take some gambles you never know what can happen. Now I don't want them throwing 10 million away gambling on a guy long term but a million here and there, especially on one season deals, won't hurt them too much and they may find a gem.

My problem with the Bordick deal is that you know what you are getting (he is not suddenly going to turn his career around at age 37 and hit .300 with 30+ homeruns next season) and you also know that barring a major injury to Woodward he will probably only get about 100 at bats or so. With a .230 batting average last year that is only the difference of 3 hits for your team from a .200 hitting backup which could be signed for the league minimum. Even over 200 Abs you are looking at 3-6 more hits for a much higher salary. I think even if Woodward tanks he will still get the bulk of the Ab's as the Jays will want to give him his chance.

Now with Sturtze you also probably know what you are going to get, a losing pitcher who has an era above 4.5, possibly higher than 5.0. But then again... maybe not. His 2001 season wasn't all that bad (11-12, 4.42 era, 195 ip) and his scouting report suggests there is a chance much of his problems are simply mental mistakes which perhaps the Jays can straighten out:

" ASSETS: He has good heat thanks to his size but most of all he can get hitters to beat the ball into the ground. He's strong with runners in scoring position. Off the mound, he's a capable fielder, never having made an error in 46 major-league chances.
FLAWS: His head tends to stray prematurely toward the dugout with two out and he gets beat up. On the whole, his pitch placement needs work because when he gets hit he gets hit hard and when you get hit hard after giving up all the bases on balls he gives up, you're in trouble. "

I would throw a million dollars at a couple guys like this and if even one of them can turn things around you have to be happy. This was a guy in a horrible situation last year and that couldn't have helped his numbers. Don't get me wrong... my money is still on him bombing but at least there is hope of more.

holyroller · 12-22-2002, 04:32 PM

To quote that great modern philosopher Derrick Coleman, "whoo-de-damn-doo"

MJohnson · 12-22-2002, 08:40 PM

No bad mouthing Mike Bordick, he's the best baseball player in University of Maine history. That's pretty good coming from a hockey school

lnkpark · 12-22-2002, 09:57 PM

i dont understand why bordick turned down a starting position and 1.5 million with the orioles.

crackpott · 12-22-2002, 10:04 PM

...perhaps because it's the Orioles.

Recte44 · 12-24-2002, 02:15 PM

Not sure what Bordick was thinking here. First he said he was going to play for Baltimore or retire, then he turns down a higher offer from the O's to be a backup in Toronto, who is rebuilding. Hmmm.

tsq_bone · 12-30-2002, 01:55 PM

The difference is that Toronto has a chance, albeit a very small one, to contend this one. Baltimore has no chance.

12-20-2002, 05:35 PM	#1
JAttractive All Star Starter Join Date: May 2002 Location: St. Catharines, Ontario Posts: 1,135	Jays sign Mike Bordick... Whoopee doo! http://waymoresports.thestar.com/NAS...path=Home/Home 1 million for a 37 year old back-up infielder who hit .232 last season. Ok he is great defensively and I understand the need to have veteran's and such but moves like this just bother me. It just seems like a complete waste of 1 million dollars when the Jays will turn around and go cheap on a player and fail to sign/re-sign them or fail to add a solid regular or starting pitcher. I know a million dollars doesn't seem like much anymore but the Jays will turn around and not sign a more useful guy over even smaller differences in salary. Take for instance Kevin Millwood. The Braves basically gave him up for free and probably would have taken less than the Phillies offered just to get him out of the division. He is expected to make 10 million in arbitration this season and while that is a far cry from 1 million if you cut out enough of these types of signings you could have taken him or at least a player in a similar circumstance that a team is looking to unload... or maybe they could have kept a guy like Chris Carpenter or Mike Sirotka and pray they return to form in a year. They would be bargains for their salary if they did and not overly costly gambles if they fail and yet they lose them over a few hundred thousand dollars difference. I just hate that you know what you are getting with a guy like Bordick already which isn't much and he will probably only play in a very limited number of games to boot. At the same time for his salary you could take some gambles on guys or use the money somewhere more important. I still like J.P. but these are the types of moves that irritate me.

12-20-2002, 06:08 PM	#3
crackpott Hall Of Famer Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: Toronto Posts: 2,961	No way Millwood gets 10M in arbitration, but anyway... I'm kinda glad we got Bordick. 1M isn't unreasonable, and it's nice to have some insurance around for when Woodward fails seeing as Lopez is gone. __________________ Abandoned Planet - Check it out. The photos don't suck anymore.

12-22-2002, 01:34 PM	#5
crackpott Hall Of Famer Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: Toronto Posts: 2,961	if that was bad note that we just gave 1 million to Tanyon Sturtze. __________________ Abandoned Planet - Check it out. The photos don't suck anymore.

12-22-2002, 04:32 PM	#7
holyroller Hall Of Famer Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: OTBL Forums Posts: 3,532	To quote that great modern philosopher Derrick Coleman, "whoo-de-damn-doo" __________________ Back to work, but not drawing a paycheck. TonyJ et. al.'s alias “I confused it with the chicken’s neck,” Mocanu, who was admitted to the emergency hospital in Galati, was quoted as saying. “I cut it ... and the dog rushed and ate it.”

12-22-2002, 09:57 PM	#9
lnkpark Minors (Single A) Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Baltimore, MD Posts: 50	i dont understand why bordick turned down a starting position and 1.5 million with the orioles. __________________

12-20-2002, 05:39 PM	#2
JAttractive All Star Starter Join Date: May 2002 Location: St. Catharines, Ontario Posts: 1,135	Ok maybe saving 1 million is still a bit of a stretch in bringing in Kevin Millwood but my point is that there are probably other players in Millwood's situation that teams are looking to unload as well. Yet there are always back up infielders lieing around at the start of the season that can be picked up for the league minimum and probably wouldn't make much difference over Bordick for the amount they play... that is my point.

12-20-2002, 06:38 PM	#4
JAttractive All Star Starter Join Date: May 2002 Location: St. Catharines, Ontario Posts: 1,135	Yeah I just used the 10 million figure because that is what the ESPN article said. I really have no idea. I also agree that Woodward's season last year was a fluke and while I also agree having Bordick around is nice insurance I don't like to see them throw even a million dollars around at this point in things when they still have some glaring holes. Maybe J.P. already has plans in the works for those though so I may be jumping the gun a bit here but I really think they could have waited to sign a back-up infielder in case that money is useful later. Apparently a million dollars is suddenly worth something again (based on some of the recent moves teams have made).

12-22-2002, 02:10 PM	#6
JAttractive All Star Starter Join Date: May 2002 Location: St. Catharines, Ontario Posts: 1,135	Maybe I am too much of a gambler-type but I actually don't mind this deal. I figure the Jays are not exactly favourites to contend next season but if they take some gambles you never know what can happen. Now I don't want them throwing 10 million away gambling on a guy long term but a million here and there, especially on one season deals, won't hurt them too much and they may find a gem. My problem with the Bordick deal is that you know what you are getting (he is not suddenly going to turn his career around at age 37 and hit .300 with 30+ homeruns next season) and you also know that barring a major injury to Woodward he will probably only get about 100 at bats or so. With a .230 batting average last year that is only the difference of 3 hits for your team from a .200 hitting backup which could be signed for the league minimum. Even over 200 Abs you are looking at 3-6 more hits for a much higher salary. I think even if Woodward tanks he will still get the bulk of the Ab's as the Jays will want to give him his chance. Now with Sturtze you also probably know what you are going to get, a losing pitcher who has an era above 4.5, possibly higher than 5.0. But then again... maybe not. His 2001 season wasn't all that bad (11-12, 4.42 era, 195 ip) and his scouting report suggests there is a chance much of his problems are simply mental mistakes which perhaps the Jays can straighten out: " ASSETS: He has good heat thanks to his size but most of all he can get hitters to beat the ball into the ground. He's strong with runners in scoring position. Off the mound, he's a capable fielder, never having made an error in 46 major-league chances. FLAWS: His head tends to stray prematurely toward the dugout with two out and he gets beat up. On the whole, his pitch placement needs work because when he gets hit he gets hit hard and when you get hit hard after giving up all the bases on balls he gives up, you're in trouble. " I would throw a million dollars at a couple guys like this and if even one of them can turn things around you have to be happy. This was a guy in a horrible situation last year and that couldn't have helped his numbers. Don't get me wrong... my money is still on him bombing but at least there is hope of more.

12-22-2002, 08:40 PM	#8
MJohnson Major Leagues Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: under an overpass Posts: 459	No bad mouthing Mike Bordick, he's the best baseball player in University of Maine history. That's pretty good coming from a hockey school

12-22-2002, 10:04 PM	#10
crackpott Hall Of Famer Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: Toronto Posts: 2,961	...perhaps because it's the Orioles. __________________ Abandoned Planet - Check it out. The photos don't suck anymore.

12-24-2002, 02:15 PM	#11
Recte44 Global Moderator Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: Oconomowoc, WI Posts: 2,818	Not sure what Bordick was thinking here. First he said he was going to play for Baltimore or retire, then he turns down a higher offer from the O's to be a backup in Toronto, who is rebuilding. Hmmm. __________________ Matt Rectenwald Commissioner, GM: Las Vegas Hustlers, The Brewster Baseball Association- fictional league (JOIN NOW)

12-30-2002, 01:55 PM	#12
tsq_bone Minors (Rookie Ball) Join Date: Mar 2002 Posts: 49	The difference is that Toronto has a chance, albeit a very small one, to contend this one. Baltimore has no chance.