Best time to convert from OOTP9?

[nate wooley]

I'm in an online league and we're considering converting from OOTP9 to OOTPX. We're currently in January 2007 and someone asked me what time of year is best for conversion to make it easy for the players.

Anyone have any advice?

[Alan T]

Originally Posted by nate wooley

I'm in an online league and we're considering converting from OOTP9 to OOTPX. We're currently in January 2007 and someone asked me what time of year is best for conversion to make it easy for the players.

Anyone have any advice?

Absolutely do not convert at the end of the season prior to arbitration. That causes all kinds of grief. My recommendation would be to do it during the preseason stage (Feb 1st or so).

[Stu]

Originally Posted by Alan T

Absolutely do not convert at the end of the season prior to arbitration. That causes all kinds of grief. My recommendation would be to do it during the preseason stage (Feb 1st or so).

Can you go into details on what kinds of issues it causes? I've tested a few times and haven't seen problems.

[Alan T]

Originally Posted by Stu

Can you go into details on what kinds of issues it causes? I've tested a few times and haven't seen problems.

You need to allow OOTPX to enter the arbitration stage on its own and not be upgraded from OOTP9 after arbitration has begun. Otherwise owners will end up possibly not being able to see the arbitration page and not have any way of offering arbitration up to their players. In many cases this fixes itself by the next season, but there have been reports of leagues that still did not see arbitration the following season either after upgrading during the middle of arbitration.

Likewise due to various behavior in Free Agency compensation, it is ideal to not really upgrade right in the middle of free agency. Upgrading after the majority of the players which would demand compensation have signed helps with some of those immediate issues. I am not aware of any long term effects of that however.

Upgrading at the start of the preseason stage will also allow you to work out any issues that you may have with the schedule (some reports of people in the past upgrading after preseason finished and finding no schedule for whatever reason. You can't modify the schedule once the season starts, so they had a year with no games).

[satchel]

Originally Posted by nate wooley

...what time of year is best for conversion to make it easy for the players.

Anyone have any advice?

The game manual's exact words: “we recommend converting after your last playoff game, before proceeding to the offseason.”

[Corsairs]

Our league is about to convert and we've chosen to do so just before the start of preseason for many of the reasons that Alan T. mentioned. While it's true that the manual recommends converting right after the conclusion of the postseason, it's been my experience from previous conversions that waiting until just before the arrival of the preseason makes for a smoother transition. That's a period of time where very little is going on in the league. There are simply less moving parts to break.

[TribeFanInNC]

I will play devil's advocate a little. The thing I don't like about converting during preseason is that the player ratings get what I call 'recalibrated' in the new version, i.e. they change some to fit changes in the coding and modelling.

If you change in the preseason:
a) you might have just locked someone up for 5 years that took like a 20% hit in ratings - basically you just wasted a bunch of money.
b) if guys already on your team change (either up or down), you really don't have much opportunity to retool your team starting in February.

But, I agree the arby point brought up by Alan is problematic. I think I agree with the manual in concept, but I'm not a commish.

Has anyone tried converting in those couple days between arbitration and the start of FA?

[Alan T]

Originally Posted by TribeFanInNC

I will play devil's advocate a little. The thing I don't like about converting during preseason is that the player ratings get what I call 'recalibrated' in the new version, i.e. they change some to fit changes in the coding and modelling.

If you change in the preseason:
a) you might have just locked someone up for 5 years that took like a 20% hit in ratings - basically you just wasted a bunch of money.
b) if guys already on your team change (either up or down), you really don't have much opportunity to retool your team starting in February.

But, I agree the arby point brought up by Alan is problematic. I think I agree with the manual in concept, but I'm not a commish.

Has anyone tried converting in those couple days between arbitration and the start of FA?

I really wouldn't upgrade between arbitration and FA. If you are dead-set on upgrading prior to free agency, you should do it during the "Playoff" stage when the final game finishes, but before you sim ahead one day to the "Offseason" Stage. Doing it at that point does not give you much time to work through issues that your league may encounter, but it is safer than doing it between arbitration and FA stage.

The only other comment I'd have regarding your point A is that is a risk that everyone encounters any time any league upgrades anyways. There isn't really any more likelihood that a player you just signed to a contract will tank rating wise than say someone who was already on your team with a 5 year contract if that makes sense

[TribeFanInNC]

Originally Posted by Alan T

The only other comment I'd have regarding your point A is that is a risk that everyone encounters any time any league upgrades anyways. There isn't really any more likelihood that a player you just signed to a contract will tank rating wise than say someone who was already on your team with a 5 year contract if that makes sense

I agree the risk exists no matter what. But in October, you have a lot more retooling option - not offer arby, sign guys, not sign guys, etc... By February, your team should be pretty much set. If you get conversion changes, then you pretty much just lose a season because your finances are pretty locked in and your rosters choices are finite.

I guess my end all point is that if you change in preseason, I as a GM just made a bunch of decisions for the entire offseason based on information that might change. Just giving more of a end user perspective rather than a commish perspective. I certainly see where you guys are coming from though. I would want to limit problems too.

[texasmame]

Originally Posted by nate wooley

I'm in an online league and we're considering converting from OOTP9 to OOTPX. We're currently in January 2007 and someone asked me what time of year is best for conversion to make it easy for the players.

Anyone have any advice?

Don't convert at all unless you want your closers to be in the rotation.

[snnort]

Originally Posted by satchel

The game manual's exact words: “we recommend converting after your last playoff game, before proceeding to the offseason.”

This is what the BCBL did and things were smooth as a babies butt. No GM had any issues at all with offering arby. And this way provided the best method for the GMs to at least read the OOTP X scouting reports before placing bids on them.

If you convert after some, any, or all players have signed FA contracts... you risk people bidding on players that end up not being what they actually bid on.

[snnort]

Originally Posted by texasmame

Don't convert at all unless you want your closers to be in the rotation.

Yes the line between reliever and starter has been further blurred by OOTP X... but is this also not how it is in RL?

Back in the days before OOTP 9 you knew exactly which pitchers were going to be starters and which were not about 90+% of the time. AND you knew this the day the engine created each pitcher as a young lad for the first year player draft. AND you knew by looking at one rating, endurance.

It is much more realistic to be doubtful about where a guy will fit. Obviously there are going to be guys that have defined roles right out of the gate, but OOTP 9 and further with OOTP 10 blurr the line so that many, many more pitchers COULD fall either way depending on how they progress in their late teens and early 20's. It's much more realistic.

Determining who is a starter and who is a reliever should not be so easy as to see how many pitches a guy can throw in a session. It's much more complicated in real life, and it's nice that it's that way in OOTP now, as well.

That's my 2 cents.

P.S. : Lee Smith almost became a starter. In his 3rd ML season in '82, he started 5 games for the Cubs.

[HH20xx convert]

Originally Posted by snnort

Yes the line between reliever and starter has been further blurred by OOTP X... but is this also not how it is in RL?

Back in the days before OOTP 9 you knew exactly which pitchers were going to be starters and which were not about 90+% of the time. AND you knew this the day the engine created each pitcher as a young lad for the first year player draft. AND you knew by looking at one rating, endurance.

It is much more realistic to be doubtful about where a guy will fit. Obviously there are going to be guys that have defined roles right out of the gate, but OOTP 9 and further with OOTP 10 blurr the line so that many, many more pitchers COULD fall either way depending on how they progress in their late teens and early 20's. It's much more realistic.

Determining who is a starter and who is a reliever should not be so easy as to see how many pitches a guy can throw in a session. It's much more complicated in real life, and it's nice that it's that way in OOTP now, as well.

That's my 2 cents.

P.S. : Lee Smith almost became a starter. In his 3rd ML season in '82, he started 5 games for the Cubs.

I agree with the sentiment, but the conversion to OOTP 10 has produced some nasty surprises for some. After the final patch, I'm going to do a test conversion then set some house rules and go back to OOTP 9 and edit the endurance of pitchers the conversion recognized as starter material that are actually long-time relievers. This will take hours, but my league integrity won't let me settle for the conversion process Markus is satisfied with. I recommend a test conversion to see if you are one of the unlucky ones that have an OOTP 9 league that is handled poorly by OOTP 10.