Trying to Understand VORP Formula

MightyQuinn · 07-10-2009, 12:32 AM

I feel I want this forumla for what I am doing but having issues trying to figure it out.

If someone would like to tell me what forumla OOTP 10 uses that would be great

Do they break it down per position, replacement level of .75 for catchers, .85 for 1b & DH and .8 for everyone else ??? or do they use one replacement value ???

So first you figure the outs of a player
(AB-hits)+SF+SH+CS+GDP = total outs

Leagues Average Runs per out * Players total Outs = Number of Runs an average players would have produced.

Take that number *replacement level (.8, .75, .85 or what ever) = Number of Runs you could Expect a replacement player to produce.

Players actual runs created - Replacement Players

Now another problem is the formula for Runs Created

tysok · 07-10-2009, 12:45 AM

That's good enough to get you some numbers.
The actual formulas that OOTP uses aren't known except to Markus. Theoretically, though, what you do there would end up with the same list top to bottom as OOTP even if the numbers weren't the same... but theory sucks.

MightyQuinn · 07-10-2009, 03:12 PM

Who is Markus, I searched his name for posts and got no results.

What I am trying to do is create an all-time franchise team for each team and it is hard to pick the best 1st baseman of a team when so many played throughout the years and all did great. I saw the VORP number when I ran a few quick seasons, at one point Lou Gehrig was over 175 VORP which was easily twice of the next player. So if I could get this formula that rated players based on their season, I could change their season to a team and rate the players from that. For most teams I wouldnt really have to worry about the Stadium factor as all the players played most of their games at the same stadium.

I have completed more then half of the teams in excel files and find it hard alot of times to decide which player to pick. I find some players hit .272 and have an OB% of 405 and other players hit 321 and OB% of 376. In my mind runs are the number one thing a batter is to create runs, 2nd would be getting on base so the next player could try to create runs. Also for me all averages should be based on Plate Appearances and for pitchers, Batters faced.

Now I have added Total Average and a forumla I came up with which is Runs Scored + Runs Batted In - Home Runs = Overall Runs divided by Plate Appearances. Now a Pittsburgh Pirate named Jake Stenzel who played outfield in 1894 hit .354, OBP .441 and create a run 42.5% of his plate appearances. I did Bonds season where he was on base over 60% and he only created a run 30% of the time. Now '30 OF Al Simmons (PHA) hit .381 OB% 423 (Which has nothing to do with plate appearances) and create a run 46.0% of his plate appearances !!! I think this is the first one I Found where the Runs Created was higher then their OBP but I havent done most of the older teams yet. Based on PA him getting on base was .411 yet he create a run .460 (152 RS + 165 RBI - 36 HR = 281) His hits 211 + Walks 39 + 1 HBP = 251 / PA = .411

eriqjaffe · 07-10-2009, 03:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MightyQuinn

Who is Markus, I searched his name for posts and got no results.

Markus Heinsohn. Y'know, the guy who makes OOTP.

tysok · 07-10-2009, 03:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MightyQuinn

Who is Markus, I searched his name for posts and got no results.

What I am trying to do is create an all-time franchise team for each team and it is hard to pick the best 1st baseman of a team when so many played throughout the years and all did great. I saw the VORP number when I ran a few quick seasons, at one point Lou Gehrig was over 175 VORP which was easily twice of the next player. So if I could get this formula that rated players based on their season, I could change their season to a team and rate the players from that. For most teams I wouldnt really have to worry about the Stadium factor as all the players played most of their games at the same stadium.

I have completed more then half of the teams in excel files and find it hard alot of times to decide which player to pick. I find some players hit .272 and have an OB% of 405 and other players hit 321 and OB% of 376. In my mind runs are the number one thing a batter is to create runs, 2nd would be getting on base so the next player could try to create runs. Also for me all averages should be based on Plate Appearances and for pitchers, Batters faced.

Now I have added Total Average and a forumla I came up with which is Runs Scored + Runs Batted In - Home Runs = Overall Runs divided by Plate Appearances. Now a Pittsburgh Pirate named Jake Stenzel who played outfield in 1894 hit .354, OBP .441 and create a run 42.5% of his plate appearances. I did Bonds season where he was on base over 60% and he only created a run 30% of the time. Now '30 OF Al Simmons (PHA) hit .381 OB% 423 (Which has nothing to do with plate appearances) and create a run 46.0% of his plate appearances !!! I think this is the first one I Found where the Runs Created was higher then their OBP but I havent done most of the older teams yet. Based on PA him getting on base was .411 yet he create a run .460 (152 RS + 165 RBI - 36 HR = 281) His hits 211 + Walks 39 + 1 HBP = 251 / PA = .411

Markus is they guy responsible for OOTP, he's the programmer as well as the other 150 hats he has in regards to OOTP.

What you typed up for a possible VORP calculation, I believe, is what I've seen in some other places. It should be good enough for you to work with even if it isn't what OOTP uses.
What OOTP uses for runs created isn't any standard method I've found, so the formula for that in OOTP isn't known either. There are a lot of methods to figure it depending on what stats you have.

Malleus Dei · 07-10-2009, 04:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MightyQuinn

Who is Markus, I searched his name for posts and got no results.

Clutch!

07-10-2009, 12:32 AM	#1
MightyQuinn Minors (Double A) Join Date: Jun 2009 Location: Doylestown, PA Posts: 183	Trying to Understand VORP Formula I feel I want this forumla for what I am doing but having issues trying to figure it out. If someone would like to tell me what forumla OOTP 10 uses that would be great Do they break it down per position, replacement level of .75 for catchers, .85 for 1b & DH and .8 for everyone else ??? or do they use one replacement value ??? So first you figure the outs of a player (AB-hits)+SF+SH+CS+GDP = total outs Leagues Average Runs per out * Players total Outs = Number of Runs an average players would have produced. Take that number *replacement level (.8, .75, .85 or what ever) = Number of Runs you could Expect a replacement player to produce. Players actual runs created - Replacement Players Now another problem is the formula for Runs Created

07-10-2009, 12:45 AM	#2
tysok Hall Of Famer Join Date: Aug 2003 Posts: 4,925	That's good enough to get you some numbers. The actual formulas that OOTP uses aren't known except to Markus. Theoretically, though, what you do there would end up with the same list top to bottom as OOTP even if the numbers weren't the same... but theory sucks. __________________ I don't know about you, but as for me, the question has already been answered: Should we be here? Yes! Jack Buck, September 17, 2001 It's what you learn after you know it all that counts. I firmly believe that any man's finest hour... is that moment when he has worked his heart out in a good cause and lies exhausted on the field of battle - victorious. (Vince Lombardi) I don't measure a man's success by how high he climbs but how high he bounces when he hits bottom. (George S. Patton)

07-10-2009, 03:12 PM	#3
MightyQuinn Minors (Double A) Join Date: Jun 2009 Location: Doylestown, PA Posts: 183	Who is Markus, I searched his name for posts and got no results. What I am trying to do is create an all-time franchise team for each team and it is hard to pick the best 1st baseman of a team when so many played throughout the years and all did great. I saw the VORP number when I ran a few quick seasons, at one point Lou Gehrig was over 175 VORP which was easily twice of the next player. So if I could get this formula that rated players based on their season, I could change their season to a team and rate the players from that. For most teams I wouldnt really have to worry about the Stadium factor as all the players played most of their games at the same stadium. I have completed more then half of the teams in excel files and find it hard alot of times to decide which player to pick. I find some players hit .272 and have an OB% of 405 and other players hit 321 and OB% of 376. In my mind runs are the number one thing a batter is to create runs, 2nd would be getting on base so the next player could try to create runs. Also for me all averages should be based on Plate Appearances and for pitchers, Batters faced. Now I have added Total Average and a forumla I came up with which is Runs Scored + Runs Batted In - Home Runs = Overall Runs divided by Plate Appearances. Now a Pittsburgh Pirate named Jake Stenzel who played outfield in 1894 hit .354, OBP .441 and create a run 42.5% of his plate appearances. I did Bonds season where he was on base over 60% and he only created a run 30% of the time. Now '30 OF Al Simmons (PHA) hit .381 OB% 423 (Which has nothing to do with plate appearances) and create a run 46.0% of his plate appearances !!! I think this is the first one I Found where the Runs Created was higher then their OBP but I havent done most of the older teams yet. Based on PA him getting on base was .411 yet he create a run .460 (152 RS + 165 RBI - 36 HR = 281) His hits 211 + Walks 39 + 1 HBP = 251 / PA = .411 Last edited by MightyQuinn; 07-10-2009 at 03:13 PM.