Pinch Hitters Strike Out Too Much

chipa_luan · 06-29-2009, 10:02 AM

I have noticed that after I have upgraded to the latest patch.. that pinch hitters strike out at a unusually high rate. Is it just me or are there other people with the same problem?

RonCo · 06-29-2009, 10:24 AM

What rate are they striking out at? How are you comparing?

chipa_luan · 06-29-2009, 11:15 AM

I've not comparing it against anything but I just noticed that almost 7/10 times that pinch hitters strike out when I pinch hit for a pitcher..

It became so obvious that I used Martin Prado and Omar Infante to pinch hit for pitchers in 6 straight games and all six times they've struck out.

RonCo · 06-29-2009, 11:49 AM

I guess you would need to look at these guy's K-ratings and the pitchers they were facing. If you flip a coin 6 times, you have about a 3% chance of getting heads or tails each time. So random chance makes this result possible, though a little unlikely.

jbergey22 · 06-29-2009, 12:05 PM

Im thinking this has to be sample size. I wouldnt think Markus would have coded a different engine for pinch hitters. Plus in all my games pinch hitting has been fine.

RonCo · 06-29-2009, 12:21 PM

Most likely. But you never know.

t-bone shuffle · 06-29-2009, 02:07 PM

I think there is definitely a problem with this in the mlb roster set, see http://www.ootpdevelopments.com/boar...iking-out.html, but for the life of me I can't understand what could be making it happen.

RonCo · 06-29-2009, 02:30 PM

Look at the avoid K ratings of the players who are pinch hitting. I would purely guess that they rate lowly, and that there is some pinch-hitting code that is further penalizing them (which there should be).

RchW · 06-29-2009, 04:07 PM

In the NL last year PH struck out 23.1% of PA. Regular batters struck out 16.9% of PA. Pitchers struck out 33.1% of PA.

The difference between regular batters and PH is not as large as anticipated. My opinion only.

Ratings will affect this in the game but a K/PA rate above 25% for PH would seem to be high.

Are PH stats available in the game. I looked but can't figure it out.

t-bone shuffle · 06-29-2009, 04:14 PM

Here's a screenshot from the game I referenced in the other thread. The league is further along now, but as you can see, most of the PH's on the first page are K'ing at a rate of 50% or higher. I've added their avoid K rate, but it doesn't really seem to matter. Also note that for the most part, they are highly unsuccessful too.

RchW · 06-29-2009, 05:10 PM

I figured out how to list PH.

This seems to be a current roster set issue. The stats posted here are from a fictional league. Definitely your results are fishy.

This is sorted by K for the just completed season.

K/PA is 26.3%, which is high but not way off.
K/AB is 28.7%.

The totals for that page are
PA AB H 2B 3B HR RBI R BB K AVG OBP
1678 1538 306 54 2 17 145 139 91 442 0.199 0.237

afail · 06-29-2009, 07:13 PM

I have noticed this too - i just let my pitcher bat now -- seems like i have better odds

ublguy23 · 06-30-2009, 11:23 AM

This issue has been logged http://www.ootpdevelopments.com/boar...gue-games.html here

chipa_luan · 07-01-2009, 01:16 PM

so it is a bug afterall =) just hoping there would be a patch for this soon coz it's a really bad user experience

conception · 07-01-2009, 01:32 PM

I have definitely noticed this kind of thing too- it's not an isolated incident. I've been using the same fictional league since 2007 and never had a problem with pinch hitters being useless.

06-29-2009, 10:02 AM	#1
chipa_luan Minors (Rookie Ball) Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: Tokyo Posts: 29	Pinch Hitters Strike Out Too Much I have noticed that after I have upgraded to the latest patch.. that pinch hitters strike out at a unusually high rate. Is it just me or are there other people with the same problem?

06-29-2009, 04:07 PM	#9
RchW Hall Of Famer Join Date: Jul 2004 Location: Toronto ON by way of Glasgow UK Posts: 15,629	In the NL last year PH struck out 23.1% of PA. Regular batters struck out 16.9% of PA. Pitchers struck out 33.1% of PA. The difference between regular batters and PH is not as large as anticipated. My opinion only. Ratings will affect this in the game but a K/PA rate above 25% for PH would seem to be high. Are PH stats available in the game. I looked but can't figure it out. __________________ Cheers RichW If you’re looking for a good cause to donate money to please consider a Donation to Parkinson’s Canada. It may help me have a better future and if not me, someone else. Thanks. “Conservatism consists of exactly one proposition …There must be in-groups whom the law protects but does not bind, alongside out-groups whom the law binds but does not protect.” Frank Wilhoit

06-29-2009, 04:14 PM	#10
t-bone shuffle All Star Reserve Join Date: Jan 2004 Location: The dull edge of the blade Posts: 867	Here's a screenshot from the game I referenced in the other thread. The league is further along now, but as you can see, most of the PH's on the first page are K'ing at a rate of 50% or higher. I've added their avoid K rate, but it doesn't really seem to matter. Also note that for the most part, they are highly unsuccessful too. Attached Images Last edited by t-bone shuffle; 06-29-2009 at 04:16 PM.

06-29-2009, 05:10 PM	#11
RchW Hall Of Famer Join Date: Jul 2004 Location: Toronto ON by way of Glasgow UK Posts: 15,629	I figured out how to list PH. This seems to be a current roster set issue. The stats posted here are from a fictional league. Definitely your results are fishy. This is sorted by K for the just completed season. K/PA is 26.3%, which is high but not way off. K/AB is 28.7%. The totals for that page are PA AB H 2B 3B HR RBI R BB K AVG OBP 1678 1538 306 54 2 17 145 139 91 442 0.199 0.237 Attached Images __________________ Cheers RichW If you’re looking for a good cause to donate money to please consider a Donation to Parkinson’s Canada. It may help me have a better future and if not me, someone else. Thanks. “Conservatism consists of exactly one proposition …There must be in-groups whom the law protects but does not bind, alongside out-groups whom the law binds but does not protect.” Frank Wilhoit

06-29-2009, 10:24 AM	#2
RonCo Hall Of Famer Join Date: Aug 2003 Posts: 10,431	What rate are they striking out at? How are you comparing?

06-29-2009, 11:15 AM	#3
chipa_luan Minors (Rookie Ball) Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: Tokyo Posts: 29	I've not comparing it against anything but I just noticed that almost 7/10 times that pinch hitters strike out when I pinch hit for a pitcher.. It became so obvious that I used Martin Prado and Omar Infante to pinch hit for pitchers in 6 straight games and all six times they've struck out.

06-29-2009, 11:49 AM	#4
RonCo Hall Of Famer Join Date: Aug 2003 Posts: 10,431	I guess you would need to look at these guy's K-ratings and the pitchers they were facing. If you flip a coin 6 times, you have about a 3% chance of getting heads or tails each time. So random chance makes this result possible, though a little unlikely.

06-29-2009, 12:05 PM	#5
jbergey22 Hall Of Famer Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: Minnesota Posts: 3,481	Im thinking this has to be sample size. I wouldnt think Markus would have coded a different engine for pinch hitters. Plus in all my games pinch hitting has been fine.

06-29-2009, 12:21 PM	#6
RonCo Hall Of Famer Join Date: Aug 2003 Posts: 10,431	Most likely. But you never know.

06-29-2009, 02:07 PM	#7
t-bone shuffle All Star Reserve Join Date: Jan 2004 Location: The dull edge of the blade Posts: 867	I think there is definitely a problem with this in the mlb roster set, see http://www.ootpdevelopments.com/boar...iking-out.html, but for the life of me I can't understand what could be making it happen.

06-29-2009, 02:30 PM	#8
RonCo Hall Of Famer Join Date: Aug 2003 Posts: 10,431	Look at the avoid K ratings of the players who are pinch hitting. I would purely guess that they rate lowly, and that there is some pinch-hitting code that is further penalizing them (which there should be).

06-29-2009, 07:13 PM	#12
afail Major Leagues Join Date: Mar 2003 Posts: 382	I have noticed this too - i just let my pitcher bat now -- seems like i have better odds

06-30-2009, 11:23 AM	#13
ublguy23 Bat Boy Join Date: Jun 2009 Posts: 3	This issue has been logged http://www.ootpdevelopments.com/boar...gue-games.html here

07-01-2009, 01:16 PM	#14
chipa_luan Minors (Rookie Ball) Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: Tokyo Posts: 29	so it is a bug afterall =) just hoping there would be a patch for this soon coz it's a really bad user experience

07-01-2009, 01:32 PM	#15
conception All Star Starter Join Date: Jan 2008 Posts: 1,150	I have definitely noticed this kind of thing too- it's not an isolated incident. I've been using the same fictional league since 2007 and never had a problem with pinch hitters being useless.