Ping: Anyone in law

His Own Bad Self · 08-15-2007, 09:37 PM

Why in the world is Tim Donaghy getting up to 25 years and harsh monetary punishment for being in a gambling ring, while Mike Vick is (AFAIK) getting no more than six years (and reportedly much, much less than that) for being in a dogfighting ring? Why is the one considered that much worse than the other? (And why is dogfighting not punished more harshly?)

Raderick · 08-15-2007, 09:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jdawgsenior

(And why is dogfighting not punished more harshly?)

I agree with you 100%

Jonzard · 08-15-2007, 09:51 PM

You can argue that Donaghy does a lot of damage to a league and in effect, hurts everyone involved with it from the NBA players, to ticket vendors, to people working for a casino in Vegas. The damage done is very far reaching and potentially financially monsterous.

The dog fighting is just social mores. Some societies would do nothing to him while others would execute him... that is much harder to pin down a punishment for.

magnet · 08-15-2007, 11:03 PM

What monsieur pancake said

bababui · 08-15-2007, 11:14 PM

Since its his first offense I doubt he will get anything close to 25 years. On the other hand, since its federal, he will have to serve 80% of his sentence. Same think with Michael Vick.

Russ · 08-15-2007, 11:15 PM

Don't **** with the feds is the lesson here.

APujols5 · 08-16-2007, 12:17 AM

Actually though Vick is supposed to be getting another indictment for Racketeering if he doesn't accept the plea bargain by Friday. Which that charge alone carries 20 years. So here's hoping he will be stupid and not take whatever deal they offer him.

Skipaway · 08-16-2007, 12:31 AM

On the account of conspiracy to commit wire fraud, the maximum penalty used to be five years, but it got changed to twenty years by Sarbane-Oxley Act in 2002.

Comedian2004 · 08-16-2007, 12:32 AM

Vick stupid? No way... Being one of the top paid quarterbacks in the league and get involved in illegal dog fighting... no... that shows signs of a real genius. Think of all the money he will save by not having to pay taxes on all the millions of dollars he is now NOT going to get.

Once he serves his time, he can write a book, telling how it was a conspiracy that set him up.

Muppetus Galacticus · 08-16-2007, 05:24 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Comedian2004

Vick stupid? No way... Being one of the top paid quarterbacks in the league and get involved in illegal dog fighting... no... that shows signs of a real genius. Think of all the money he will save by not having to pay taxes on all the millions of dollars he is now NOT going to get.

Once he serves his time, he can write a book, telling how it was a conspiracy that set him up.

"If I was involved with dog fighting, this is how I would do it"

ctorg · 08-16-2007, 07:39 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Muppetus Galacticus

"If I was involved with dog fighting, this is how I would do it"

lol

jerrycapo · 08-21-2007, 04:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jdawgsenior

Why in the world is Tim Donaghy getting up to 25 years and harsh monetary punishment for being in a gambling ring, while Mike Vick is (AFAIK) getting no more than six years (and reportedly much, much less than that) for being in a dogfighting ring? Why is the one considered that much worse than the other? (And why is dogfighting not punished more harshly?)

I am no legal expert, but I think it would be the combination of the number of counts against him and the specific crimes he is being charged for and the sentencing guidlines for those charges. So, for Donaghy's case, let's say he admitted to 50 counts of fixing basketball games with each carrying a maximum of 6 months and a $20,000 fine. Meanwhile Vick the combination of counts and maximum punishment in Vick's case would then be much less.

For a federal indictment it is about what the Feds believe they can prove in the courtroom beyond a reasonable doubt, not how heinous each individual crime is perceived to be. Therefore some less violent criminals end up doing more time than much harder criminals, based on the number of times they committed the crime.

DougWyatt · 08-21-2007, 06:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Comedian2004

Vick stupid? No way... Being one of the top paid quarterbacks in the league and get involved in illegal dog fighting... no... that shows signs of a real genius. Think of all the money he will save by not having to pay taxes on all the millions of dollars he is now NOT going to get.

You sound sarcastic, as if you think he isn't a smart guy. Well you are wrong, as .... I think Mike said it best :

"I have two weapons: my legs, my arm, and my brains." Michael Vick

DougWyatt · 08-21-2007, 06:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Muppetus Galacticus

"If I was involved with dog fighting, this is how I would do it"

Now that .... that was funny stuff !

Skipaway · 08-21-2007, 08:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jerrycapo

I am no legal expert, but I think it would be the combination of the number of counts against him and the specific crimes he is being charged for and the sentencing guidlines for those charges. So, for Donaghy's case, let's say he admitted to 50 counts of fixing basketball games with each carrying a maximum of 6 months and a $20,000 fine. Meanwhile Vick the combination of counts and maximum punishment in Vick's case would then be much less.

For a federal indictment it is about what the Feds believe they can prove in the courtroom beyond a reasonable doubt, not how heinous each individual crime is perceived to be. Therefore some less violent criminals end up doing more time than much harder criminals, based on the number of times they committed the crime.

That's not the situation here. One conspiracy to commit wire fraud already gives you 20 year maximum. Donaghy got potentially maximum 25 years only for two crimes, one 20 years, and another five. This is not to say Donaghy would really get that much.

The penalty is harsh because Enron showed that there are white collar crimes that destroy way more lives than violent crimes.

08-15-2007, 09:37 PM	#1
His Own Bad Self All Star Starter Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Phoenix, AZ Posts: 1,221	Ping: Anyone in law Why in the world is Tim Donaghy getting up to 25 years and harsh monetary punishment for being in a gambling ring, while Mike Vick is (AFAIK) getting no more than six years (and reportedly much, much less than that) for being in a dogfighting ring? Why is the one considered that much worse than the other? (And why is dogfighting not punished more harshly?)

08-15-2007, 09:51 PM	#3
Jonzard Hall Of Famer Join Date: Jun 2003 Location: Minnesota Posts: 3,647	You can argue that Donaghy does a lot of damage to a league and in effect, hurts everyone involved with it from the NBA players, to ticket vendors, to people working for a casino in Vegas. The damage done is very far reaching and potentially financially monsterous. The dog fighting is just social mores. Some societies would do nothing to him while others would execute him... that is much harder to pin down a punishment for. __________________ For a scientist must indeed be freely imaginative and yet skeptical, creative and yet a critic. There is a sense in which he must be free, but another in which his thought must be very precisely regimented; there is poetry in science, but also a lot of bookkeeping. — Sir Peter B. Medawar FTB

08-15-2007, 11:15 PM	#6
Russ All Star Starter Join Date: Oct 2005 Location: Essex HON! Posts: 1,923 Infractions: 0/1 (1)	Don't **** with the feds is the lesson here. __________________ If you don't love Russ, you don't love America. This post brought to you by Carl's Jr.

08-16-2007, 12:31 AM	#8
Skipaway Hall Of Famer Join Date: Apr 2003 Location: Where you live Posts: 11,017	On the account of conspiracy to commit wire fraud, the maximum penalty used to be five years, but it got changed to twenty years by Sarbane-Oxley Act in 2002. __________________ Jonathan Haidt: Moral reasoning is really just a servant masquerading as a high priest.

08-16-2007, 12:32 AM	#9
Comedian2004 Hall Of Famer Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: In a house in Saint Cloud, Florida. Posts: 7,085	Vick stupid? No way... Being one of the top paid quarterbacks in the league and get involved in illegal dog fighting... no... that shows signs of a real genius. Think of all the money he will save by not having to pay taxes on all the millions of dollars he is now NOT going to get. Once he serves his time, he can write a book, telling how it was a conspiracy that set him up. __________________ Like BLUES? Visit www.smokestacklightnin.com, you will LOVE it! New show every Monday!! New Blues HOF![/COLOR][/FONT]

08-15-2007, 11:03 PM	#4
magnet Hall Of Famer Join Date: Jun 2003 Posts: 5,029	What monsieur pancake said

08-15-2007, 11:14 PM	#5
bababui Hall Of Famer Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Los Angeles Posts: 14,147 Infractions: 0/1 (1)	Since its his first offense I doubt he will get anything close to 25 years. On the other hand, since its federal, he will have to serve 80% of his sentence. Same think with Michael Vick.

08-16-2007, 12:17 AM	#7
APujols5 Banned Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: CP Indiana Posts: 1,667 Infractions: 1/3 (3)	Actually though Vick is supposed to be getting another indictment for Racketeering if he doesn't accept the plea bargain by Friday. Which that charge alone carries 20 years. So here's hoping he will be stupid and not take whatever deal they offer him.