Real-Life Lineups

jprywell · 07-06-2007, 12:12 PM

Forgive my ignorance... I'm considering buying OOTPBB and playing historical leagues, which sound really excellent. I've played DMB and ActionBB but am looking for something with a little more depth.

Here are my (ignorant) questions:

-- Can you run real-life lineups with historical seasons? Is it quite time-consuming to set that up, or is it even an option in OOTP?

-- I see that the game has an AI built in? Besides calling up players from the minors and demoting or disabling others, does it also handle transactions that might happen during a season? Do players automatically come and go from teams when they are traded or released?

Thanks for the help.

jprywell

Nukester · 07-06-2007, 01:18 PM

The only way to get absolutely historically correct lineups is if you run in commisoner mode and run each team. The CPU will make lineups based on what it thinks would be the best lineup, not neccessarily the historically correct lineup. It would be ALOT of work to keep that up throughout history.

The AI will handle all transactions for CPU controlled teams, including trades, minor/major promotions/demotions, free agent signings, ect. You can even have the CPU run some of this stuff for your human controlled team, like having the CPU set you minor league lineups. Players will automatically move to new teams if traded, and if you are running a fictional league with facegen players, the players pictures will show the player in the uniform of his new team, which is very cool

jprywell · 07-06-2007, 01:25 PM

Very cool. I'm glad the CPU handles mid-season trades, like Lou Brock to SL in '64 that led to a pennant. I imagine the stats are also adjusted, depending on how the player performs with the new team (?)

I'm going to download the game this afternoon and give it a whirl. Whoe knows, you might find a converted Action and DMB player on your site!

jprywell

BaseballMan · 07-06-2007, 01:25 PM

Well you can set the league to not allow changes by the AI so i think that would cover your lineups.
But like Nukester said its probably something you would have to do manually and it would be time consuming. But then again you have to think about injuries, player devlopment and things like that. I dont think the game does trades as they happened in real life but based upon what the team needs. Remember that though the game does an excellent job at simming historical seasons and a player like Ruth will hit close to 714 most of the time, there may be times that he hits only 350 or 770 depending on how his career develops. Your not gonna see Ruth hit 714 every sim. thats what is fun about this game. It puts your historical players in the ballpark range of what they did in real life without being an exact replica and yet it still can give you the what if scenarios.

Nukester · 07-06-2007, 01:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jprywell

Very cool. I'm glad the CPU handles mid-season trades, like Lou Brock to SL in '64 that led to a pennant.

Just to be clear, the game will NOT automatically make trades that happened in real life. It will certainly make trades based on what it thinks is good for the team though. The AI will also set teams to be "neutral", "rebuilding" or "win now" modes and will trade accordingly

jprywell · 07-06-2007, 02:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nukester

Just to be clear, the game will NOT automatically make trades that happened in real life. It will certainly make trades based on what it thinks is good for the team though. The AI will also set teams to be "neutral", "rebuilding" or "win now" modes and will trade accordingly

Thanks, Nukester. I understand now. That's actually a very good thing and differentiates the game from the real-life, game-based sims such as DMB, Strat, and Action. This games sounds like a nice counterpart to those ones and could be more fun due to the elements of both variability and surprise. You're setting up a different baseball universe with this game, and that makes it exciting.

jpryweller

Nukester · 07-06-2007, 02:35 PM

Exactly. OOTP does not try to be a "replay" league like the others, where you might want to play out the 1987 season over and over. It is a career simulation, where players age and have career arcs. More of a "what if" type of game. With the introduction of the recal feature, where the game will give players new ratings each year based on a 1, 3, or 5 year average of the players last couple of years and next couple of years, it keeps historicals from getting alot of no name players in the record books, and you will generally see the same players from real life in the recordbooks, but not nessecarilly with the same stats. You could always turn off the recalc feature and have players use the default game career arcs, which will make things even more random.

You can also have new amateur players enter the game each year, either going to the same team they played on in real life, or hold an amatuer draft, and watch players go to different teams. In my last simulation, Babe Ruth ended up getting drafted by the Cincinnati Reds, and had his career HR numbers suffer because of the big dimensions of Crosley Field.

RchW · 07-06-2007, 03:03 PM

It should also be mentioned that OOTP has two historical modes. Recalc and classic.

Recalc turns off player development and uses player stats to produce the results (not sure if I explained that right). For example if Joe Blow had a bad year in 1947 he is likely to have a bad year in the game.

Classic mode keeps the development engine on. The total stat output is historically accurate but you cannot expect "Name" players to be studs as IRL or in Recalc. In fact it is likely that they will be duds. Some people do not like this mode. I do.

Maybe someone can explain Recalc better than I did.

BaseballMan · 07-06-2007, 03:17 PM

either way you wont get exact replays of real life. Not much fun in knowing Ruth is gonna hit 714 hr. Yeah you may know that Ruth has the ability to hit 714 hr but just like a scout may have thought Todd Van Popple would be a great starter you never know till you sim the season. Plus its fun to watch the seasons develop and the stories within each season and then going over the stats. Once you get your league going you might check out the dynasty forum and create your own dynasty thread. I think a lot of members here are always glad to read a different version of baseball history.

pstrickert · 07-06-2007, 03:55 PM

A few months ago, I compared DMB and OOTP by simming the 1957 season in both games. It was not a scientific study; I know that. Yet I was pleased with the results. OOTP compared favorably to DMB in terms of statistical accuracy. I concluded (tentatively) that OOTP does better with historical replays than it gets credit for. It may also be true that DMB does not quite live up to its reputation (though it is startlingly good most of the time).

If you want to use real-life lineups and transactions, then you'll want to stick with DMB or Action. Otherwise, I think this version of OOTP has made great strides in terms of historical realism. On the beta forum, in fact, I've been pestering Markus about problems with lineups, rotations, etc., after importing a historical season. I'm glad I didn't get banned because of it!

Markus made some significant changes in the latest build. I'm pleased with the results.

07-06-2007, 12:12 PM	#1
jprywell Minors (Rookie Ball) Join Date: Jul 2007 Posts: 22	Real-Life Lineups Forgive my ignorance... I'm considering buying OOTPBB and playing historical leagues, which sound really excellent. I've played DMB and ActionBB but am looking for something with a little more depth. Here are my (ignorant) questions: -- Can you run real-life lineups with historical seasons? Is it quite time-consuming to set that up, or is it even an option in OOTP? -- I see that the game has an AI built in? Besides calling up players from the minors and demoting or disabling others, does it also handle transactions that might happen during a season? Do players automatically come and go from teams when they are traded or released? Thanks for the help. jprywell

07-06-2007, 01:25 PM	#3
jprywell Minors (Rookie Ball) Join Date: Jul 2007 Posts: 22	Real-Life Transactions Very cool. I'm glad the CPU handles mid-season trades, like Lou Brock to SL in '64 that led to a pennant. I imagine the stats are also adjusted, depending on how the player performs with the new team (?) I'm going to download the game this afternoon and give it a whirl. Whoe knows, you might find a converted Action and DMB player on your site! jprywell

07-06-2007, 01:25 PM	#4
BaseballMan Hall Of Famer Join Date: Jan 2002 Posts: 6,646	Well you can set the league to not allow changes by the AI so i think that would cover your lineups. But like Nukester said its probably something you would have to do manually and it would be time consuming. But then again you have to think about injuries, player devlopment and things like that. I dont think the game does trades as they happened in real life but based upon what the team needs. Remember that though the game does an excellent job at simming historical seasons and a player like Ruth will hit close to 714 most of the time, there may be times that he hits only 350 or 770 depending on how his career develops. Your not gonna see Ruth hit 714 every sim. thats what is fun about this game. It puts your historical players in the ballpark range of what they did in real life without being an exact replica and yet it still can give you the what if scenarios. Last edited by BaseballMan; 07-06-2007 at 01:27 PM.

07-06-2007, 02:35 PM	#7
Nukester All Star Starter Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: Newburgh, NY Posts: 1,923	Exactly. OOTP does not try to be a "replay" league like the others, where you might want to play out the 1987 season over and over. It is a career simulation, where players age and have career arcs. More of a "what if" type of game. With the introduction of the recal feature, where the game will give players new ratings each year based on a 1, 3, or 5 year average of the players last couple of years and next couple of years, it keeps historicals from getting alot of no name players in the record books, and you will generally see the same players from real life in the recordbooks, but not nessecarilly with the same stats. You could always turn off the recalc feature and have players use the default game career arcs, which will make things even more random. You can also have new amateur players enter the game each year, either going to the same team they played on in real life, or hold an amatuer draft, and watch players go to different teams. In my last simulation, Babe Ruth ended up getting drafted by the Cincinnati Reds, and had his career HR numbers suffer because of the big dimensions of Crosley Field. Last edited by Nukester; 07-06-2007 at 02:38 PM.

07-06-2007, 03:03 PM	#8
RchW Hall Of Famer Join Date: Jul 2004 Location: Toronto ON by way of Glasgow UK Posts: 15,629	It should also be mentioned that OOTP has two historical modes. Recalc and classic. Recalc turns off player development and uses player stats to produce the results (not sure if I explained that right). For example if Joe Blow had a bad year in 1947 he is likely to have a bad year in the game. Classic mode keeps the development engine on. The total stat output is historically accurate but you cannot expect "Name" players to be studs as IRL or in Recalc. In fact it is likely that they will be duds. Some people do not like this mode. I do. Maybe someone can explain Recalc better than I did. __________________ Cheers RichW If you’re looking for a good cause to donate money to please consider a Donation to Parkinson’s Canada. It may help me have a better future and if not me, someone else. Thanks. “Conservatism consists of exactly one proposition …There must be in-groups whom the law protects but does not bind, alongside out-groups whom the law binds but does not protect.” Frank Wilhoit

07-06-2007, 01:18 PM	#2
Nukester All Star Starter Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: Newburgh, NY Posts: 1,923	The only way to get absolutely historically correct lineups is if you run in commisoner mode and run each team. The CPU will make lineups based on what it thinks would be the best lineup, not neccessarily the historically correct lineup. It would be ALOT of work to keep that up throughout history. The AI will handle all transactions for CPU controlled teams, including trades, minor/major promotions/demotions, free agent signings, ect. You can even have the CPU run some of this stuff for your human controlled team, like having the CPU set you minor league lineups. Players will automatically move to new teams if traded, and if you are running a fictional league with facegen players, the players pictures will show the player in the uniform of his new team, which is very cool

07-06-2007, 03:17 PM	#9
BaseballMan Hall Of Famer Join Date: Jan 2002 Posts: 6,646	either way you wont get exact replays of real life. Not much fun in knowing Ruth is gonna hit 714 hr. Yeah you may know that Ruth has the ability to hit 714 hr but just like a scout may have thought Todd Van Popple would be a great starter you never know till you sim the season. Plus its fun to watch the seasons develop and the stories within each season and then going over the stats. Once you get your league going you might check out the dynasty forum and create your own dynasty thread. I think a lot of members here are always glad to read a different version of baseball history.

07-06-2007, 03:55 PM	#10
pstrickert Hall Of Famer Join Date: Dec 2005 Posts: 17,002	A few months ago, I compared DMB and OOTP by simming the 1957 season in both games. It was not a scientific study; I know that. Yet I was pleased with the results. OOTP compared favorably to DMB in terms of statistical accuracy. I concluded (tentatively) that OOTP does better with historical replays than it gets credit for. It may also be true that DMB does not quite live up to its reputation (though it is startlingly good most of the time). If you want to use real-life lineups and transactions, then you'll want to stick with DMB or Action. Otherwise, I think this version of OOTP has made great strides in terms of historical realism. On the beta forum, in fact, I've been pestering Markus about problems with lineups, rotations, etc., after importing a historical season. I'm glad I didn't get banned because of it! Markus made some significant changes in the latest build. I'm pleased with the results.