Thoughts on 5-year Recalc Games

[Garlon]

A discussion on 5-year recalc games with amateur drafts and other musings unrelated to the original thread.

[Brad K]

Why? Sure, it's a matter of preference, but I truly don't understand having players in different ball parks, playing in years they didn't, and using different strategy, then having auto-calc negate any differences that might result from that. Please help me understand the attraction of this.

[David Watts]

I've always wanted to run something like this using 1 year recalc instead of 5. Guessing real time missed would function almost as if injuries were on instead of off. Maybe one day I will give it a shot. Probably start in 1901, as I'm not smart enough to do the 1800's stuff.

[Brad K]

Originally Posted by David Watts

I've always wanted to run something like this using 1 year recalc instead of 5. Guessing real time missed would function almost as if injuries were on instead of off. Maybe one day I will give it a shot. Probably start in 1901, as I'm not smart enough to do the 1800's stuff.

The recalc settings don't do much when auto-calc is on. The idea is that 3 and 5 year reduce the peaks and valleys in players output. But when a players ups and downs follow the leagues ups and downs - often the case - auto-calc raises and lowers the players so the league can achieve its historic output. After all, a league having an up or down year requires the players in aggregate to have an up or down year.

In a year like 1977 with a lot of HRs compared with the years around it, using 3 year or 5 year lowers the players power ratings. But when auto-calc runs it increases the output from those ratings.

[David Watts]

Originally Posted by Brad K

The recalc settings don't do much when auto-calc is on. The idea is that 3 and 5 year reduce the peaks and valleys in players output. But when a players ups and downs follow the leagues ups and downs - often the case - auto-calc raises and lowers the players so the league can achieve its historic output. After all, a league having an up or down year requires the players in aggregate to have an up or down year.

In a year like 1977 with a lot of HRs compared with the years around it, using 3 year or 5 year lowers the players power ratings. But when auto-calc runs it increases the output from those ratings.

I didn't say if I was going to use auto calc. Just curious how the results would differ from Garlon's if I were to use 1 year recalc.

[Brad K]

Originally Posted by David Watts

Not what I'm talking about, but thanks.

You said you wanted 1 year recalc instead of 5 year recalc. I'm pointing out changing the setting doesn't change anything.

[Brad K]

With five year recalc an players missing years a players ratings are reduced for the years around the missed year. However auto-calc increases the output from those ratings so league output matches historic.

With one year recalc the player gets higher ratings in the years he didn't miss. Since the ratings match historic auto-calc doesn't increase the output of the ratings.

[Brad K]

Originally Posted by David Watts

I didn't say if I was going to use auto calc. Just curious how the results would differ from Garlon's if I were to use 1 year recalc.

Given past discussions it was reasonable to assume you'd use auto-calc. If you're going to use pre-calc I'm thrilled.

[David Watts]

Originally Posted by Brad K

You said you wanted 1 year recalc instead of 5 year recalc. I'm pointing out changing the setting doesn't change anything.

So, a 1 year recalc Ted Williams will perform the same in 1944 as a 5 year recalc Ted Williams will?

[David Watts]

Originally Posted by Brad K

Given past discussions it was reasonable to assume you'd use auto-calc. If you're going to use pre-calc I'm thrilled.

Have all the kinks been ironed out of pre-calc?

[Brad K]

Originally Posted by David Watts

Have all the kinks been ironed out of pre-calc?

Apparently the 26.4.61 file works correctly if coaching is turned off.

[David Watts]

Originally Posted by Brad K

Apparently the 26.4.61 file works correctly if coaching is turned off.

Cool, I will use pre-calc, if I decide to try a quick sim through history. No need to have coaching if I'm fast simming. I use coaching in my current random debut, so I will stick with autocalc.

[Brad K]

Originally Posted by David Watts

So, a 1 year recalc Ted Williams will perform the same in 1944 as a 5 year recalc Ted Williams will?

Missing three years is a different situation than having a down year or two.

However many good players missed time in WWII years and offense was lower. If you put all of those players into 1944 and use 5 year to boost their ratings their output from those ratings will be reduced by auto-calc.

The next thing that comes into play is how much those ratings are reduced by adjust/weaken. But the end question is what ratings do those players get on one year recalc when there is insufficient data and OOTP does it's own thing, whatever that is.

[Brad K]

Originally Posted by David Watts

Cool, I will use pre-calc, if I decide to try a quick sim through history. No need to have coaching if I'm fast simming. I use coaching in my current random debut, so I will stick with autocalc.

SB attempts are wrong when coaching is on. If other things aren't quite right the differences are very small and not apparent from any cursory examination.

[Garlon]

With 5yr recalc it adds up all the AB or IP in that span. In this game I set AB to 1100/700. Even if a player has a gap season and did not play as long as they had 1100 AB over those 5 seasons in the recalc period they get their full rating. The advantage of multiyear recalc is that you can get a good sample for player ratings.

Real Ty Cobb from 1911-1913 batted .407
OOTP 5yr recalc Ty Cobb 1911-1913 batted .408

[Garlon]

I think if you are using 1yr recalc, then a player with a gap season will just have their ratings hold over from the previous season. That was an update that Matt made for OOTP25 I think.

For example, Ted Williams missed 1943-1945 to military service. If you started in 1942 using 1yr recalc, Ted will keep his 1942 ratings into 1943, 1944, and 1945 I believe.

[David Watts]

Originally Posted by Garlon

I think if you are using 1yr recalc, then a player with a gap season will just have their ratings hold over from the previous season. That was an update that Matt made for OOTP25 I think.

For example, Ted Williams missed 1943-1945 to military service. If you started in 1942 using 1yr recalc, Ted will keep his 1942 ratings into 1943, 1944, and 1945 I believe.

I does appear to be as you say. Williams doesn't miss a beat with one year recalc on during the war years. Nice. So much better than him becoming a bench player during those years.

[Brad K]

Originally Posted by David Watts

I does appear to be as you say. Williams doesn't miss a beat with one year recalc on during the war years. Nice. So much better than him becoming a bench player during those years.

Yes.

I also checked importing him. It doesn't apply there. He imports 1944 as one star.

It appears that the talent reduction during WWII affected hitting more than pitching, so unchecking miss seasons would improve offense with pre-calc. One of the situations where red and yellow on the accuracy page is good!

[Brad K]

Originally Posted by Garlon

With 5yr recalc it adds up all the AB or IP in that span. In this game I set AB to 1100/700. Even if a player has a gap season and did not play as long as they had 1100 AB over those 5 seasons in the recalc period they get their full rating. The advantage of multiyear recalc is that you can get a good sample for player ratings.

Real Ty Cobb from 1911-1913 batted .407
OOTP 5yr recalc Ty Cobb 1911-1913 batted .408

Long ago I adopted three hear recalc due to having the impression it made it less likely players would have outlier performances. I recently realized that with auto-calc they rode the ups and downs of the league.

Now that I'm using pre-calc with 3 year recalc they don't ride the ups and downs of the league. I don't know if that will reduce outlier performances.

[David Watts]

Using 1 year recalc, Barry Bonds hit 897 career home runs. In 2001 he hit 98 home runs and drove in 197 runs. Good for a 1.579OPS.