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dsvitak 01-13-2023 06:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rudel.dietrich (Post 4965666)
I would walk 5,000 miles barefoot in the snow for $200 million

....on a bad ankle.

Cobra Mgr 01-14-2023 10:02 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Déjà Bru (Post 4965760)
If today's date was April 1, I would really be discounting this. As it is, I merely am politely doubtful as to the authenticity of this report.

In addition to the stunning likeness, the same unusual name? And, "In 2015, the doppelgängers were first mistaken for one another when they both had the exact same elbow surgery performed by the same doctor, named Dr. James Andrews"?

Notice that somehow they picked out the same style of glasses? My B.S. meter is registering disbelief.

You may not know him, but Dr Andrews is the most famous sports doctor in the US. There isn't a pitching coach in the majors who has touched more arms than him.

Déjà Bru 01-22-2023 03:44 PM

1 Attachment(s)
Harbinger of the future?

Attachment 926078

Déjà Bru 01-22-2023 04:05 PM

Regarding Beltran, I find myself onboard with this writer (David Lennon of Newsday). I reluctantly go along with his allegiance to Bonds and Clemens for the reason he states, but when he applies a similar standard to Beltran, he makes a good point in my opinion.
Quote:

Personally, I’ve tried to be fairly consistent when it comes to those stained by steroids. If Major League Baseball chose to suspend/penalize a player for violating the PED policy, either with a positive test (Manny Ramirez) or a damning paper trail (Alex Rodriguez), then I would consider them disqualified. That never happened with seven-time MVP Barry Bonds or seven-time Cy Young Award winner Roger Clemens, so if MLB was fine keeping them eligible, I certainly had no problem with doing the same on my ballot. And yet, after navigating the PED minefield for more than a decade or so, a new conundrum arose this year: the debut of Carlos Beltran.

Statistically speaking, Beltran belongs in the Hall of Fame. He’s a nine-time All-Star. His 435 home runs place him fifth among centerfielders (Willie Mays is first with 660), and only Tris Speaker (792) and Ty Cobb (724) have eclipsed his 565 doubles. That Adam Wainwright curveball aside, Beltran was a standout postseason performer, hitting .307 with 16 homers, 14 RBIs and a 1.021 OPS in 65 post-season games.

Beltran finally got his World Series ring in 2017 with the Astros at the end of his 20-year career, and therein lies the problem. Two years after that triumphant moment, it came to light that the Astros used TV cameras and a trash can to engineer a very illegal sign-stealing operation during that championship run, and Beltran was singled out by MLB as one of the ringleaders along with good friend Alex Cora.

Everyone knows the details by now. No need to rehash them here. But again, as with the PED discussion, I’m more interested in MLB’s choice of disciplinary action.

Officially, only three people were suspended: general manager Jeff Luhnow, manager AJ Hinch and Cora, who was the Astros’ bench coach at the time. The only player named by MLB was Beltran; he was retiring and commissioner Rob Manfred had otherwise cut a deal with the union to grant amnesty to the active members of the roster.

While Beltran was not disciplined by MLB, being named was enough, and the Mets really had no choice but to fire him after only 77 days and zero games as manager. That has turned out to be among the most severe penalties stemming from the scandal. Cora sat out only one season before returning to manage the Red Sox in 2021 and Hinch was hired to manage the Tigers the same year.

As for Beltran, he’s made it as far as the YES broadcast booth but to this point has declined any opportunities to rejoin a team for an on-field role.

Should Beltran’s punishment now extend to Cooperstown? I say no, considering that I’ve included him on my ballot this year along with five holdovers: Billy Wagner, Andruw Jones, Todd Helton, Scott Rolen and Gary Sheffield.

Maybe Beltran, given his extraordinary baseball IQ , indeed was the mastermind behind the Astros’ sign-stealing plot. But he had plenty of co-conspirators, and none of the players who benefited from the illicit behavior were penalized for it. The Astros got to keep their Commissioner’s Trophy along with the riches gained by the title, so where was the justice in this case?

For that reason, I’m not going to play Cooperstown cop for Beltran. His career numbers don’t carry any PED asterisk, so we’ll consider those valid, and that resume is enough.

thehef 01-22-2023 04:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Déjà Bru (Post 4969056)
Regarding Beltran, I find myself onboard with this writer (David Lennon of Newsday). I reluctantly go along with his allegiance to Bonds and Clemens for the reason he states, but when he applies a similar standard to Beltran, he makes a good point in my opinion.

Re Bonds and - perhaps to a lesser degree - Clemens, I don't need that kind of proof. I apply the O.J. Simpson standard, in that there is zero doubt that he did it, despite what Lance Ito's clown court may have decided.

And we know - as the writer acknowledges - that Beltran was guilty of blatant cheating, of distorting for posterity a championship - and was much more involved than simply knowing about it and saying nothing, or even just going along with it, like surely many BlackStros did. IMO that is a significantly worse offense than using PED's. That Manfred in his infinite misjudgment and gutlessness saw fit to only give slaps on the wrist to a few non-players and to completely un-punish the players involved - including Beltran - is of no consequence. Again, IMO.

That said, re Bonds & Clemens, and as I've posted here before, I don't necessarily think PED users should be excluded from the HOF. In those two examples, however, I am still enjoying the fact that they are being excluded - unfairly as it may or may not be - simply because (and Bonds more so than Clemens) they were complete jerks, both regarding their lack of admittance/remorse for PED's, and just in general.

Syd Thrift 01-25-2023 10:50 AM

Wow, I actually agree with Curt Schilling about something:

https://twitter.com/gehrig38/status/1618018018688397312

Amazin69 01-25-2023 08:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Syd Thrift (Post 4969982)
Wow, I actually agree with Curt Schilling about something:

https://twitter.com/gehrig38/status/1618018018688397312

Congrats, you can be wrong together. :friday:

More seriously, the comments on Schilling's Twitter thread spell out the problems with "he bet on his own team, nbd!" quite succinctly:

1) A player who bets on his own team in certain games, or who varies the amount of his wager from game to game, has an incentive to try harder in those games than when he doesn't have money on the line. Thus he may become dangerously aggressive (or conversely, "prudent" when there's no $$$ in it), damaging the integrity of the game.

One commenter alleges that Rose (as a manager) burnt out Rob Murphy because he had money on some of the games and while that's unproven, it clearly illustrates a possible danger.

2) A player who has any sort of contact with bookmakers (or through them, organized crime) is in severe danger of being led to fix games, down the line.

There's a reason there were so many forbidden places for ballplayers in Kansas City that Bouton quotes somebody in Ball Four as saying, "wow, you can save $900 just by drinking in the hotel bar".

(The logic being that the hotel bar was a $100 fine, since that's where the manager/coaching staff drank and drunk players + drunk management is just another Billy Martin story waiting to happen. But the off-limits places, which were known hangouts for unsavory types, carried a $1000 fine. [And these were in 1969 dollars. $1000 then is $8090 today.] Because a bar fight is one thing; a player who owes money to the mob is another.)

Really, for me, the revelation is that Rose was betting on games as a player, which I did not know. So, IMO, he should have been kicked out of the game that much sooner. Bravo to Giamatti for going where others had been too chicken to tread.

Cobra Mgr 02-01-2023 05:24 PM

https://scontent-iad3-1.xx.fbcdn.net...fQ&oe=63DEEBD9

Westheim 02-02-2023 01:29 AM

Savage.

rudel.dietrich 02-02-2023 11:52 AM

So it finally happened.

I follow MLB so little now, that the MLB the Show 23 cover was announced and when I read the cover athlete name, I had no idea who it was.

I had to look him up to even see who it was.

I think this officially means I don't follow baseball anymore.
It is bitter sweet.

Westheim 02-02-2023 12:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rudel.dietrich (Post 4972055)
So it finally happened.

I follow MLB so little now, that the MLB the Show 23 cover was announced and when I read the cover athlete name, I had no idea who it was.

I had to look him up to even see who it was.

I think this officially means I don't follow baseball anymore.
It is bitter sweet.

Jazz Chisholm has had one good half-season. He's mostly famous for dying his hair blue or something, I don't know.

I googled the cover and thought "huh? who do the FISH have??" - and my Mets are in the same division...! :laugh:

If anything that gaudy cover shows everything that's wrong in baseball and the world.

rudel.dietrich 02-02-2023 12:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Westheim (Post 4972062)
Jazz Chisholm has had one good half-season. He's mostly famous for dying his hair blue or something, I don't know.

I googled the cover and thought "huh? who do the FISH have??" - and my Mets are in the same division...! :laugh:

If anything that gaudy cover shows everything that's wrong in baseball and the world.

I don't mind the cover art or the player they choose.

MLB really does need to appeal to people under the age of say...60
And Chisholm is young and black and actually shows human emotions when he does something good on the field.
Baseball needs more of that, players with actual human personalities.
Who knows what his future holds, he may flame out and last year may of been a career year.
But Sony took a chance on him.

I had no clue who he was. I am 38 and find baseball to be dreadfully boring and overly long.
I can't imagine Gen Z having any interest.

And it just so happens that I work for a sports economics firm that researches these things.
And Gen Z does it fact have almost no interest in baseball.

It comes in like 11th among their favorite sports.

I wonder when that revenue bubble will burst and they will finally realize they need to radically revamp the sport.

monkeyman576 02-02-2023 12:33 PM

The Show is against big money free agent signings so they are making a statement and going for the marlins "star".

Amazin69 02-02-2023 01:15 PM

I keep telling The Millville (NJ) Meteor, there is a New York team that's much more likely to make the playoffs than the Halos. He should give them a call.

(Okay, two such teams, if you want to be technical. And a Philadelphia one as well. [MIllville is in South Jersey, aka West Jersey as the Swedes had it.] And I've only ever actually "told" Mike all this in my head. But still.)

Meantimes, I'm now having horrible thoughts of Pete Rose nobly betting on the Reds' success, only to find the "sure thing" games ruined by horrible performances by marginal players and pitchers (ie, his teammates who were already in hock to the gamblers and needed to make some quick $$ before the ticket to Indianapolis came due), resulting in Pete needing make an occasional "error" himself. Only to be told, "Don't worry about it, we're actually rooting for you guys. The World Series will be a snap. You wouldn't believe how much Graig Nettles owes us…"

And that's why you kick the ****ing gamblers out, period. Now off to check the stock market, which is completely different from gambling, I swear!

And congrats to Chaz Jism!! (Hey, let me have my fun. There won't be as good a Spoonerism available unless we get a "Phil Tucker" coming down the pike…)

cephasjames 02-13-2023 06:54 PM

MLB makes extra-innings ghost runner rule permanent for regular-season games

Quote:

MLB's 11-person joint competition committee includes six team representatives, four player representatives, and one umpire representative. Given the makeup of the committee, MLB can jam through any rule change proposals it wants, though the extra-innings tiebreaker was approved unanimously. People within game clearly like the rule more than most fans. (emphasis mine)
Ugh.

monkeyman576 02-13-2023 06:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cephasjames (Post 4975827)

Owners will do anything to protect their investments.

cephasjames 02-13-2023 06:58 PM

Another one.

MLB approves new rule to cut down on position players pitching ahead of 2023 season

Quote:

Not including Shohei Ohtani, there were a record 132 position player pitching appearances in 2022, or slightly less than one per day. That number was 89 in 2021. There were 93 position player pitching appearances total from 2010-15, and there were 57 total during the entire 1990s. Putting a position player on the mound used to be the ultimate humiliation. Now it's a strategy.
Quote:

Under the new guidelines, leading teams have to be up by 10 or more runs in the ninth inning in order to let a position player pitch while trailing teams can use a position player anytime it's down by eight or more runs. Position players are also allowed to pitch anytime in extra innings.

thehef 02-13-2023 07:15 PM

Re those two rules: The wussification of the game continues. Not just in how the game & strategy have evolved, but also via codification. Thank goodness for OOTP.

Déjà Bru 02-13-2023 11:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by thehef (Post 4975836)
Thank goodness for OOTP.

You said it.

mytreds 02-14-2023 12:01 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rudel.dietrich (Post 4972066)
I am 38 and find baseball to be dreadfully boring and overly long.

I am 37 and find baseball great to watch, especially the games from 10-20 years ago. Sounds like you need to follow another sport. People with your mindset need to stop trying to change a sport that was already good. Go to another sport or make your own. This is the national pastime for Pete’s sake. You don’t need to change it! It’s like wanting to change the Eiffel Tower or the Pantheon.


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