Are any of the collection missions (besides lives) worth doing?

[Orcin]

Originally Posted by chazzycat

Honestly it seems like the community here is VASTLY overestimating the difficulty involved with collection speculation.

They literally released a bunch of sets where all you have to do is sort various decades by WAR and go out and buy those players. Several BFF teams made a KILLING this way in the past week or two based on that simple approach.

Myself I did not participate in the feeding frenzy, purely out of principle...I don't enjoy the market side of the game. But Quc is right, that is objectively the correct way to play the game.

To me, there are three ways to play the game...

1) Be a predator.
2) Outspend the competition with real money.
3) Play it for fun.

I tried #2 last year, and it was relatively successful but ultimately unsatisfying. I am trying #3 this year, which puts me in the same position as the vast majority of the player base. I understand the frustration associated with trying to complete missions while fighting off the market manipulators. There are very few "correct" ways to play the game that don't involve predatory practices (#1). I think all games that involve money eventually devolve into this state.

[chazzycat]

I agree. To me at the end of the day, this is a game and I play for fun, which is why I don't participate in the market side of the game. I'm here for the baseball. But it's still ok to recognize the other side exists and that it's a smart play to take advantage of it.

[IanIachimoe]

Originally Posted by chazzycat

I agree. To me at the end of the day, this is a game and I play for fun, which is why I don't participate in the market side of the game. I'm here for the baseball. But it's still ok to recognize the other side exists and that it's a smart play to take advantage of it.

I agree.

just started a pack-pull only team & it's the most fun I've had yet.

[Lukas Berger]

Without trying to be too negative, some of this discussion is getting kind of weird.

First there's a complaint, 'oh the game is stacked against people who don't spend money'. Replies are, no that's not true, you just have to invest some time.

Then the complaint changes to 'oh but the game is stacked against people who don't spend money or time'. Replies are, no that's not true either, if you have some knowledge you can apply.

Then the complaint changes to 'oh but the game is stacked against people who don't spend money or time or have knowledge to apply'. The reply to that could easily be, no, even then you just have to get lucky and pull a couple great cards out of packs and sell them for a king's ransom.

Then I guess the complaint changes to 'sure, but the game is stacked against people who don't spend money or time or have knowledge or luck'.

Ummmm, ok, sure. Darn, I guess you got us there!

There are thousands of folks playing PT and if you're bringing nothing more or even less to the table than those thousands of other folks, why would you expect to ever be anything other than just another face in the crowd?

Even there, all is not lost. Shoot for winning stone or iron or bronze league titles. Or try to be a playoff team at whatever level is comfortable for you. Try to build a theme team. Experiment with teams based on eras or specific play styles or specific types of players or types of cards.

There are plenty of levels to play at and plenty of ways to play the game that can be interesting and satisfying but that don't involve making the Perfect League or mixing it up at the highest levels and can be done no matter how little money, time, knowledge or luck you can bring to the table.

[Orcin]

Originally Posted by Lukas Berger

Even there, all is not lost. Shoot for winning stone or iron or bronze league titles. Or try to be a playoff team at whatever level is comfortable for you.

The way that the game is structured, this is impossible. If you win a title or even finish in the top 6 playoff teams, then you get promoted. Eventually, you are at your highest level of incompetence where you can no longer hope to win a title or even make the playoffs.

[Lukas Berger]

Originally Posted by Orcin

The way that the game is structured, this is impossible. If you win a title or even finish in the top 6 playoff teams, then you get promoted. Eventually, you are at your highest level of incompetence where you can no longer hope to win a title or even make the playoffs.

Then a few weeks go by and a few more folks come up and then you get relegated back to a level you are comfortable at.

[Lukas Berger]

Or then the goal can change to 'just make the playoffs once at this realty hard level'. It might take some time, but if it's not easy to do, it'll be that much more satisfying when it does happen.

[bailey]

Originally Posted by Lukas Berger

Or then the goal can change to 'just make the playoffs once at this realty hard level'. It might take some time, but if it's not easy to do, it'll be that much more satisfying when it does happen.

You have a lot of courage to leap into this thread! You forgot one of the big complaints about how easy it is to make a solid team from live mission reward cards.

[Marleigh]

Originally Posted by Lukas Berger

Then a few weeks go by and a few more folks come up and then you get relegated back to a level you are comfortable at.

Or you can just languish in mediocrity



In 2033 I added Perfect Joe Morgan to my 70s team at a cost of 105k, result 2 more wins. the finding your level doesn't really work if you are good enough to avoid relegation but bad enough to never even have sniff of the playoffs, it makes you disengage with the game. Is there even a point logging in when you pretty much know how the season is going to go.

[Coriolanus]

Somewhere down the line you'll probably be able to choose what kind of league you want to play in, and by creating rules, will be able to separate the pools a bit and not dump everyone into whale tanks and figure eventually the flotsam will settle. Clearly the future lies in teams made to fit certain themes(/acquisition styles like packs-only, etc) that enable them to access certain leagues. This one size fits all stuff is.... basic.

[OMGPuppies]

Originally Posted by Orcin

The way that the game is structured, this is impossible. If you win a title or even finish in the top 6 playoff teams, then you get promoted. Eventually, you are at your highest level of incompetence where you can no longer hope to win a title or even make the playoffs.

With that attitude, the majority of professional teams shouldn't even bother to play the season, right? Be the next Billy Beane. Zig when the other teams zag. Find a way to compete against all odds. Take it as a challenge. QC and others have given you some tips you can use to be more competitive.

My f2p makes the playoffs in Diamond every now and then, and I'm a complete moron. If I can do it, so can you!

The bottom line is to enjoy the game. If it is no longer enjoyable then do something that it is.

[Lukas Berger]

Originally Posted by OMGPuppies

With that attitude, the majority of professional teams shouldn't even bother to play the season, right? Be the next Billy Beane. Zig when the other teams zag. Find a way to compete against all odds. Take it as a challenge. QC and others have given you some tips you can use to be more competitive.

My f2p makes the playoffs in Diamond every now and then, and I'm a complete moron. If I can do it, so can you!

The bottom line is to enjoy the game. If it is no longer enjoyable then do something that it is.

I had a long reply typed out, but I realized this one is better, so I'm just quoting you instead

[Lukas Berger]

Originally Posted by bailey

You have a lot of courage to leap into this thread! You forgot one of the big complaints about how easy it is to make a solid team from live mission reward cards.

Well, last year was the complaint that we made things too hard for ftp players to be competitive off the bat. This year we came up with a way to fix that and now the complaint is that it's too easy

It's weird, it's almost like people just like to complain, no matter what

But more seriously, obviously we are always looking at ways to balance things better and we'll make tweaks each year to do this. We look closely to how things are working out and listen to all the ideas and suggestions folks have and try to incorporate those that make sense. The 'too easy' Live missions are an example of that.

So we are paying attention and taking on board the lessons from this year as well as previous years and next year we should hopefully be able to hit more of the happy medium between 'too hard' and 'too easy'.

Not to mention, finding a way to structure the missions to provide a bit more variety to teams as well.

[benderguy1]

Originally Posted by Lukas Berger

Not to mention, finding a way to structure the missions to provide a bit more variety to teams as well.

I think this is the key. It should be easy and engaging to put together a good team -- and the LIVE missions accomplished that this year. From what I can tell, it's more the lack of variety in teams once the LIVE Missions were completed by most players that made it less interesting. I like the idea where the Live Missions lead to packs with guaranteed, but random, Diamond Historicals/Gold Historicals.

[mayday10]

It is a balancing issue. Rewards for f2p players is great, but there is a combination of easy-to-attain (common and no value) and power of the cards, as well as other things like low supply of better cards and the IV drip of pp that makes this software/economy hit a wall after a point for most users.

The live collections are fun and engaging. Getting good rewards are great. I was spending like 8 hours some pandemic days working the auction house trying to get those. But then you are sent into this purgatory in Silver, gold, and below-average diamond teams where everyone has the same cards and there really isn't much to do because improvements from the SE Live Cards are very expensive and uncommon. As someone mentioned, you could spend over $50 real dollars-worth in pp on one player and the improvement is very marginal. I wouldnt even think to spend real money on the game right now because it goes nowhere, or at least I lack the capability of making all sorts of prediction models to make it go a long way.

This is a great game and has a lot of potential. I am here engaged because I am excited about it and see the vast possibilities and would like to help mold this thing into an even better baseball world. I dont like to complain... but I like to offer constructive criticism. I dont think OOTP 'dropped the ball' or anything and understand how immensely challenging it must be to create a structure that works (even one that works as well as the current one).

[pappyzan]

Originally Posted by OMGPuppies

and I'm a complete moron.

and I agree!

[dkgo]

2/3 of teams by definition won't make the playoffs each year. It is a competitive game at its core. I feel that the game does a good job in that simply spending more money isn't the only solution and will only get you so far. While a couple thousand bucks will get to the best team very quickly, it hits a ceiling while everyone else catches up.

As Lukas said, if you aren't investing money, time, strategy, or getting lucky then how can you realistically expect to do better than anyone else, let alone the players who are? Imagine being in an online league but not taking the time to look for free agents or discuss trades, obviously you are going to fall off from the pack.

[jda]

Originally Posted by pappyzan

and I agree!

Thank goodness someone finally said it. That dude is such a moron.


Semi-on-topic, having the tourney tour as an alternate way to compete in the game is a fantastic idea. If you ignore open/no-cap, most f2ps (given enough time) can put together strong, competitive teams for a variety of formats. And cap in particular is a format where brute force fails against good team-building strategy.

[bailey]

Originally Posted by benderguy1

I think this is the key. It should be easy and engaging to put together a good team -- and the LIVE missions accomplished that this year. From what I can tell, it's more the lack of variety in teams once the LIVE Missions were completed by most players that made it less interesting. I like the idea where the Live Missions lead to packs with guaranteed, but random, Diamond Historicals/Gold Historicals.

They tried that with the TOTD missions. I was not impressed. Instead of 3 historical packs, why not at least have the choice of 30 regular packs?

[mayday10]

Im thinking an SE Reward could be like an "SE Orioles Historical Pack" where you open a pack when you complete the Orioles and it is only Orioles Historical cards and a guaranteed Gold (or better) historical player. So-on and so-forth with the other teams. For the Divisions, you could have an "SE American League East Pack" that extends it to all teams in the Division and gives an Historical Diamond (or perfect) from an AL East team. Same thing with AL and MLB. Maybe the leagues could guarantee a >94 diamond and MLB is a guaranteed historical perfect.

These would be great rewards, fun, and spread out the distribution of who has what, and you wouldnt have tons of really good cards that are worth between a 4K insta-sell and 8K.